Buffy/Riley... why it didn't work.

[elisi]

Watched 'Into The Woods' yesterday and had something of an epiphany...

First of all, I have to say that Riley's feelings of being unneeded are set up very nicely, but - it comes back to the old saying:

You shouldn't be in a realtionship if you want to be made happy, but to make happy.

I'm not saying that Riley should have continued with an unsatisfying relationship, but he left because she didn't make him feel a certain way:

RILEY: You say that, but I don't feel it. I just don't feel it.

Anyway, this brings me to my main point. It was these lines that suddenly stood out:

BUFFY: Oh, I'm sorry. You know, um, I'm sorry that I couldn't take care of you when I thought that my mother was dying.
RILEY: It's about me taking care of you! It's about letting me in. So you don't have to be on top of everything all the time.
BUFFY: But I do. That's part of what being a slayer is. And that's what this is really about, isn't it? You can't handle the fact that I'm stronger than you.
RILEY: It's hard sometimes, yeah. But that's not it.

Riley misunderstands her there. She is NOT talking about physical strength. She is talking about the strength to walk to her own death when 16 years old. The strength to kill the love of her life. The strength to carry to weight of the world on her shoulders and not let up, because no one else can carry her burden:

First!Buffy: Look hard. What do you see?
Caleb: Strength. And the loneliness that comes with real strength.
'Dirty Girls'

A strength (and inherent weakness) that Spike of course understands:

And the thing about the dance is, you never get to stop. Every day you wake up, it's the same bloody question that haunts you: is today the day I die?
'Fool For Love'

Buffy tried to warn Riley, way back in 'Doomed' - and his response was that people could get through these things if they looked after each other. But that's never going to work with Buffy... not really. Because she's a Slayer:

Spike: I know slayers. No matter how many people they've got around them, they fight alone. Life of the chosen one. The rest of us be damned.
LMPTM

This is Riley's tragedy - Buffy would never, ever need him the way he wanted her to.

And we saw that even when unsouled Spike in some ways understood Buffy better than Riley. And when souled could give her what Riley never could - support without asking for anything in return:

Spike: I'm not asking you for anything. When I say, "I love you," it's not because I want you or because I can't have you. It has nothing to do with me.

Mostly, I think the whole thing is summed up best in this icon by _jems_, which was what spurred on my initial thought:



(ETA: This is the short version. If you want *long* B/R meta, I got that too! *g*)

Comments

[frenchani.livejournal.com]

Here I can't resist the urge to quote Tom McRae's song "Stronger Than Dirt" from Just Like Blood:

Somebody wake me up
The dream is growing coldAnd the
night is all we haveLeft to hold
Somebody sail
this ship
Navigate this crowd
For what I once saw as
landI see as cloud

But I am stronger than
you
And I am braver than you
And I will still be here
When the dust has cleared

Sometimes nothing is
The better hand
And you throw it all for this
I understand

But I am stronger than you
And I am braver than you
And I will still be here
When the dust has cleared
Will you ?
Will you, will you, will you
And I will still be here
When the dust has
cleared
And I will still be here
When the dust has cleared

Will you?

You will never get close to me
You will never get close to me
This is who we are
This is who we are
You will never get close to me
This is who we are...
You will never get close to me
Who we are...

Buffy could have sung that...

[elisi]

Wow. Thank you so much! There should be a vid!

[http://users.livejournal.com/_jems_/]

That's actually where I got the lyrics from. =)

[prophecygirrl.livejournal.com]

People dismiss Riley too easily, I think, and for the wrong reasons
(whitebread, normal, bland). Your explanation, on the other hand, comes centrally from the characters, and is so much better because of it.

[elisi]

People dismiss Riley too easily, I think, and for the wrong reasons
::nods:: Although I hardly find him exhilarating to watch, I think he was a good man.

Your explanation, on the other hand, comes centrally from the characters, and is so much better because of it.
Thank you! :) Oh and RIley letting Sandy bite him is... hot! I was very surprised, but it is!

[mikeygs.livejournal.com]

[i]This is Riley's tragedy - Buffy would never, ever need him the way he wanted her to. [/i]

Exactly! They just expected different things out of the relationship. And like I said before, my hangup with Riley was that he had no reason to think she was the type of person who *would* need him like that. That and the way he turned that around and threw it in her face, as if it was some kind of deficiency on her part... *deep breath*

[elisi]

They just expected different things out of the relationship.
Indeed.

I think Riley never really understand what being a Slayer meant... he saw it as being some sort of super-soldier, when what it is about is sacrificing everything for the mission if necessary. Riley was forever focussing on the physical, but Buffy's 'thing' for vampires was never about anything that simple. Of course Spike's 'she needs a little monster in her man' didn't help at all and just got Riley's thoughts fixed on the wrong issue.

See what I also thought of was 'I'm not ready for you not to be there.' Which implies need - and the knowledge that she has to overcome it. Because that's what being a Slayer is...

Poor Buffy.

[rahirah]

'Course that's also why Buffy won't work with anyone, in the long run. Even Spike couldn't bear that kind of relationship indefinitely.

[elisi]

Oh but 'Chosen' changes all that.

Faith: Yeah, you're not the one and only chosen anymore. Just gotta live like a person. How's that feel?

[petzipellepingo.livejournal.com]

This is Riley's tragedy - Buffy would never, ever need him the way he wanted her to.
And, IMO, a big part of that is Riley's absurb expectations of her. Her Mother is dying and he can't handle her being preoccupied with her Mother's health and well being. Of course Buffy cares for him but she's the Slayer and that means the job comes first and at the moment, Mom comes second. And somehow being third on the list (or possibly fourth depending on how you view her care for Dawn) just doesn't sit right with him; which, IMO, is incredibly selfish of him.
And therfore we can only assume that Sam must convince him that her world revolves are his wants and needs. Which makes our view of the marriage in AYW a lot more flawed than it appears. But then, of course, we are looking at it through Buffy's eyes.

[elisi]

And somehow being third on the list (or possibly fourth depending on how you view her care for Dawn) just doesn't sit right with him; which, IMO, is incredibly selfish of him.
*nods* It's understandable, but I doubt he realises how badly hurt she was by Angel - she learned the hardest way possible that the mission should always come first.

And therfore we can only assume that Sam must convince him that her world revolves are his wants and needs.
Not necessarily, but I think theirs is a fairly normal marriage - f.ex. if she was to become pregnant she could quite the demon hunting squad and so could he... they have options that Buffy never did.

Hi! In here from the Sunnydale Herald...

[rachelmap.livejournal.com]

And therfore we can only assume that Sam must convince him that her world revolves are his wants and needs. Which makes our view of the marriage in AYW a lot more flawed than it appears.

Either that, or Sam broke him of that bad habit. I think it's possible because while Buffy tended to bottle up her negative feelings until she exploded (or the problem went away--and how often does that happen in the Jossverse?), Sam seemed the type to get those feelings off her chest right away. How many times did she bawl him out? The way I see it, Riley needed someone who would give him propmt feedback on his wrong behavior; someone who'd smack him upside his head and say: "Hey, Stupid! Stop being stupid!"

(Not that I think that there's anything wrong with Buffy being a 'stewer' rather than an 'exploder'; both types have their strengths and weaknesses. It's just that sometimes one's a better 'fit' than the other.)

[lusciousxander.livejournal.com]

I really enjoy reading essays about Riley that do not include "Boring bigoted jerk", thank you so much for these insightful essays.

I'm starting to really like Riley lately, he's such a sweetie, I especially love his scenes with Buffy's friends.

[elisi]

I really enjoy reading essays about Riley that do not include "Boring bigoted jerk"
Hee! I don't love Riley - he's just a bit too bland - but I can certainly see where he comes from. He's just... nice.

[shapinglight]

Poor Buffy! It's a lonely life all right.

Very insightful, as always.

[elisi]

Poor Buffy! It's a lonely life all right.
I love that Chosen changed all that! (And then she settles down with Spike and Angel... *g*)

And thank you. :)

[morgantree.livejournal.com]

Beautiful exposition. Thanks once again for laying out your thoughts for us.

BTW, is c4j's Spuffy soundtrack downloadable from somewhere?

[elisi]

Thank you! :) And I can't really help the sharing thing... it comes as standard with the obsession I think! *g*

And I don't think the soundtrack is downloadable anymore (it's more than a year old at least)... but if you like I could zip it for you and send it your way?

[diachrony.livejournal.com]

...the strength to walk to her own death when 16 years old. The strength to kill the love of her life. The strength to carry to weight of the world on her shoulders and not let up, because no one else can carry her burden...

This is why I ♥ Buffy so much.

And Spike, for understanding her so thoroughly.

Your essays make me go sniffly at my desk at work! And smile at the same time. :~)

[elisi]

Your essays make me go sniffly at my desk at work! And smile at the same time. :~)
Aw, thanks! And I *heart* my sweet OTP too! :)

[stultiloquentia.livejournal.com]

Riley misunderstands here there. She is NOT talking about physical strength.

That's a pretty great point in a pretty great essay.

[elisi]

Thanks! :) It was all suddenly so obvious!

[dlgood.livejournal.com]

I'm not saying that Riley should have let Buffy use him the way she was, but he left because she didn't make him feel a certain way:

Riley misunderstands here there. She is NOT talking about physical strength.

No, I think he gets that. It's much simpler. He's in love with her, and he wants her to love him as much as he loves her. He wants someone he can have a long term with. Buffy doesn't love him like that, and she doesn't want that long term. And he leaves because he doesn't want to settle.

There's lots of pointless and possibly unecessary drama, because Buffy maybe doesn't realize this, or if she does - doesn't want to tell him that. Doesn't want to have to end what is a good short term deal for her - but keeping that going would have required her investing more in him than she could given her own stresses.

At the end of the day, they break down because she's not just that into him. They should. And they both do some dumb/insentive things, Riley more than Buffy, but there's no real villain.

Which, I think, makes it interesting and relatable.

[elisi]

Buffy doesn't love him like that, and she doesn't want that long term. And he leaves because he doesn't want to settle.
Oh absolutely. I don't dispute that at all. But I think that he misunderstands what being a Slayer is... he focusses on the physical - lets himself get bit because he wants to understand what her deal with vampires is. But that's never what it was about - we see in S6 that Spike never once bites Buffy and she never wants him to. It's *partly* to do with the inner darkness that she has, but I don't think it had to have been such an obstacle. Mostly it's the fact that Riley would *always* be secondary to the mission - which for Buffy is such a fundamental truth that she doesn't even think about it anymore (she had to kill Angel).

At the end of the day, they break down because she's not just that into him. They should. And they both do some dumb/insentive things, Riley more than Buffy, but there's no real villain.
*nods* Spring Summers has an excellnt analysis of them here.

Also I have to recommend this drabble by st_salieri which is the best encapsulation of Riley I have ever read!

[thirdblindmouse.livejournal.com]

Riley misunderstands here there. She is NOT talking about physical strength. She is talking about the [...] strength to carry to weight of the world on her shoulders and not let up, because no one else can carry her burden

Nice clarification. It's good to see some meta on Riley that doesn't just dismiss him. I thought a sign that their relationship was doomed came very early on, when Riley said he loved her because she was "a mystery", and Buffy said she just wanted a "nice, normal guy". By the end of "Hush" Buffy has realized that he isn't the essence of normality she had pictured him to be, and Riley is starting to see that there is a reality behind the mystery that he might not be able to handle.

[elisi]

Nice clarification.
I'm glad it works. :)

It's good to see some meta on Riley that doesn't just dismiss him.
Buffy dated him for more than a year... so clearly there was something to their relationship. Which is the sort of stuff I love trying to unpick.

I thought a sign that their relationship was doomed came very early on, when Riley said he loved her because she was "a mystery", and Buffy said she just wanted a "nice, normal guy".
::nods a lot::

(I also wrote a long post about that a while ago if you feel like reading more! :) Anyway, thanks for commenting.

[lavastar.livejournal.com]

Oh, wow. Definitely. Never quite got that in those words, that makes so much sense.

When Riley's saying he wish Buffy would have let him in when she found out about her mom...it's not about wanting to help her so much as wanting her to be vulnerable with him. Which is why she feels she can't be, and goes to Spike.

[elisi]

Oh, wow. Definitely. Never quite got that in those words, that makes so much sense.
*beams* I felt terribly clever when I first thought of it. I love it when something suddenly clicks.

it's not about wanting to help her so much as wanting her to be vulnerable with him.
*nods* The correct response to a situation like that is 'What can I do?' (which is pretty much what Spike says) - you don't dictate what kind of help you're going to offer/what other people need. (Riley doesn't understand the difference, I don't think.)

[kikimay]

*QUOTES EVERY SINGLE WORD*
I love your thoughts about Buffy.
Actually, I've always felt pity for Riley in season 5 while, looking past to season 4, I can't even stand him. I mean, he's a good guy after all and it's funny his interaction with Willow or Xander, but he and Buffy are BOOORING! Zero chemistry between them, plus Spike is a perfect companion for the Slayer so there's really no contest. *does a little spuffy dance*
But, yes, she's stronger and braver than him and he doesn't accept that.
And he kinda have more chemistry with troll!Angel. *uhms*