Chibnall and the metal bikini

[elisi]

So, when trying to think back on the new showrunner's previous work, one episode did of course stand out...

Now a cyber woman fighting a pterodactyl is probably the single most iconic moment of Torchwood, and as someone who likes my crack deep fried I rather adore it.

However, there is the question of the metal bikini, and at whose feet we shall lay that whole fiasco? Before decrying Chibnall as an evil sexist (have we been on this band wagon before? Why yes we have! If you are in charge of Doctor Who, it is self-evident that you hate women/all minority groups/anyone else you can think of) I thought I'd try to find out if the outfit was his idea, or if - like the case with Amy's skirt - it was something completely out of his hands. (Amy's short skirts were Karen Gillan's idea, and had nothing to do with Moffat.)

For anyone not familiar with the episode is centers around the fact that one of the characters, Ianto, has hidden his girlfriend, Lisa, in the Torchwood basement. The twist being that she's a part-converted cyberman [see the S2 finale of Doctor Who]. Why this is problematic should be evident from these images:





I couldn't find a good quality image of her feet, but those are cute little Cuban heels she's wearing, a million miles from the big stompy footwear cybermen are usually seen wearing.

As I don't have access to the shooting scripts, I instead watched the Declassified episode for 'Cyberwoman' (it's from 2007). I transcribed the relevant parts:

Here is RTD talking about Lisa's outfit:

"There is a very long history of sexy pneumatic hydraulic women, strangely, in Science Fiction, and we actually wanted to tap into that, and to give a Cyberman version of that, which is just irresistible."

[Cue scene of Japanese science guy perving over Lisa, while Ianto looks disgusted]

RTD cont: "Great, iconic imagery of that woman, trapped, in half a cyberman suit. Brilliant."

[Then there's some talk by the costume/props people about how she's half converted, and trying to figure out what's underneath the cybermen's shiny exterior. And the actress was quite taken with her outfit.]

Director James Strong: "It was so important for this episode that the Cyber Girl looked a) amazing, but also looked threatening and looked scary and looked formidable, but still looked sexy and looked great."

RTD: "There are a lot of men on the team who were absolutely determined to make that Cyber Woman costume as sexy as possible. I've got no idea what they mean. I'm the one sitting there going 'Couldn't she do with a nice little bikini bottom in case she gets too cold in this environment? Apparently it's very very sexy..."

[Then a section where the cast talk about how scary she is - to their credit not one of them mentions the word 'sexy' just that she was intimidating.]

Director: "I think Cyber Girl be the most iconic monster and villain in the entire series...

[montage of Cyber Woman & pterodactyl]

RTD: "The idea of having a pterodactyl fight a cyber woman made us laugh for about three weeks. Solidly."

So... Unless the shooting script has 'SEXY' underlined and highlighted, I don't think we can lay the metal bikini at Chibnall's door - it seems to have been a team effort, quite literally. And RTD very clearly found the whole thing hilarious.

To be honest it's quite weird watching it. Like - can't you hear yourselves? But it's very clear that they wanted A Sexy Cyborg, and A Sexy Cyborg is what we got. Whether we should haul up every man involved, or quite simply blame the sexism that permeates society (and that this episode is a perfect example and symptom of), I can't say.

Let's all just hope that at some point, someone took Chibnall aside and said: 'That metal bikini? Was truly terrible, never do it again.'

Although to be fair, Torchwood was at that point still at the jumping up and down going: 'Look! Look! I'm all adult and violent and grim and full of sexual content!!!' stage. And I guess nothing symbolises that more than the sexy cyborg...

Because, if I'm honest, I'm not really outraged*, I'm just nostalgic. It was stupid, but ridiculously so, in that very special Torchwood way: It was also the episode where Jack - quite literally - snogged Ianto back to life.

And I'd rather have had hundred more offensive cyber women, than Miracle Day. :(

They killed my show, and I'm still sad. So I guess that's my final thought:

Dear Chibnall, please make Doctor Who full of weird and wonderful crack, but without objectifying women. And I'm pretty sure you're on that already. Thank you.


ETA: PLEASE BE CIVIL. I realise this is a hornet's nest, but I have no axe to grind. I generally like everyone & everything. (Except Miracle Day.) /fandom's Pollyanna



*They all wanted her to be sexy, and not one of them seems to have spoken up against it. It's just quietly depressing, much like when you read about studies showing just how much women are discriminated against, still, in every way.

Comments

[elisi]

Funny, yes, but overall I'm happy he left that particular conversation out. People were angry enough with him already.

[cynthia2015.livejournal.com]

It was basically Ten being annoyed at the baddie for other reasons. The Doctors face when Donna "flirted".:)

RTD did wish he had left the "spies" scene in though.

[elisi]

The Doctor does good faces. :)

However, I'm sure you can imagine how fandom would have taken the 'only travelling to find a husband' line. Fandom can be very humourless...

And yeah, the spies bit would have been brilliant!

[cynthia2015.livejournal.com]

I guess so. By the look on Donnas face, I'd thought she was only teasing the Doctor.

David and Catherine's body language and facial expressions are so nsync.:)

However, there are two things that seemed odd to me:

(1) Donna is self-conscious when she is referred to as "Miss". Like being single is bad.

(2) Donna is more impressed by a "proper" rocket compared to the TARDIS. The latter travels in time and space!

Although some thought Donna getting excited over being on an alien planet for the first time was wierd?

The Doctor had a delayed reaction to Donnas comment hence the "ferrari boy" remark he muttered and probably why he tries to teach Donna to fly the TARDIS in the next episode.

[elisi]

I guess so. By the look on Donnas face, I'd thought she was only teasing the Doctor.
Oh I'm sure! But I'm sure you know what fandom is like...

(1) Donna is self-conscious when she is referred to as "Miss". Like being single is bad.
Donna has a lot of issues, which I like - she's so loud, partly to cover up her insecurities.

(2) Donna is more impressed by a "proper" rocket compared to the TARDIS. The latter travels in time and space!
But the other one looks cooler! (Although yes, I'm sure that's why he began teaching her.)

Although some thought Donna getting excited over being on an alien planet for the first time was wierd?
People are weird.

[cynthia2015.livejournal.com]

Ten did looked freaked out when Donna wanted to go home after seeing what was happening with the Ood. Luckily she changed her mind.

Donna being self-conscious about being single probably comes from not having the best luck with men. In my case, I get annoyed when people ask me all sorts of inappropriate questions when they find out I'm single.

The TARDIS being just a "box" comment reminds me of when women are not impress by a guys car because it's not "fancy" enough.

My brother told me a girl said "not impressed" when he had to give her a lift in his first car which was a Nissan Pulsar. I told my brother that he should have told her to walk. I get defensive about these things.

To be fair, some people though Rose got too excited at the beginning of New Earth, while others though Amy didn't get excited enough. It depends on which episode that is being referenced.

[elisi]

Donna being self-conscious about being single probably comes from not having the best luck with men. In my case, I get annoyed when people ask me all sorts of inappropriate questions when they find out I'm single.
*nods* And everyone thought Darcy & I were SO YOUNG when we got married (which we were - I was 20, he was 19), so it's hard to do anything right... (I love that Amy & Rory got married young. It's so very rare to see that.)

My brother told me a girl said "not impressed" when he had to give her a lift in his first car which was a Nissan Pulsar. I told my brother that he should have told her to walk. I get defensive about these things.
I get annoyed when car adverts imply that all women care about is a guy's car. Sad that such women actually exist. :(

To be fair, some people though Rose got too excited at the beginning of New Earth, while others though Amy didn't get excited enough. It depends on which episode that is being referenced.
Oh yeah, can't do it right no matter what.

[cynthia2015.livejournal.com]

It use to be considered normal to marry young but society has changed and sometimes your viewed as deprieving yourself of experiencing the leisures of life or whatever its called.

Then on the other hand if you haven't settled down by the time you are in your thirties, you are concidered unconventional.

I don't have the lifestyle to find a partner right now but my brother is looking into match making me, which I'm a bit apprehensive about.

Car adverts don't seemed to make any sense these days. One ad had a woman tell a guy to stay in the car because in her imagination he was "hot" inside it!.

I prefer fun ads like cars that turn into a robot and starts dancing.:D

Ads that have superficial women in them are insulting to the female population.
I don't understand how thats a good way to promote a product.

I hope I make sense. I delayed my reply for this post because my cat passed away. My mind is all over the place so to speak.

[elisi]

Then on the other hand if you haven't settled down by the time you are in your thirties, you are concidered unconventional.
Yes - conventions have changed, but you're still expected to conform...

I don't have the lifestyle to find a partner right now but my brother is looking into match making me, which I'm a bit apprehensive about.
I hear ya. Maybe humour him for a couple of dates, and then put your foot down?

I prefer fun ads like cars that turn into a robot and starts dancing.:D
I think my favourite one is this one. :)

Ads that have superficial women in them are insulting to the female population.
They try to appeal to men. And having watched 2/3 of Wolf on Wall Street, it's obvious that that sort of thing still sells. (Film not recommended.)

I hope I make sense. I delayed my reply for this post because my cat passed away. My mind is all over the place so to speak.
(((hugs)))) That's awful. Sending you all my sympathy.

[cynthia2015.livejournal.com]

Conformity. I remember learning that topic for English class in high school.

I usually stick to a transcript and ignore the judgmental look on people's faces.

To be fair, I do want to get married. I find it hard to trust people especially after my brother got a divorce. My former sister in law was a big fat liar.

I read your other post. You don't have to convince me. I saw the movie poster. Seriously?. In this day and age.

Sexist ads are just alienating the rest of society.

I had to do reserch on Flake ads over the decades for a Retail Assessment. They are targeted to women and yet so suggestive to men.

In Australia a juice ad was pulled off air because it objectified a man. Yet women are still used as sexual objects to sell products.

Thanks for your sympathy.

[elisi]

To be fair, I do want to get married. I find it hard to trust people especially after my brother got a divorce. My former sister in law was a big fat liar.
Sorry to hear that, and hope you meet someone nice some day.

I read your other post. You don't have to convince me. I saw the movie poster. Seriously?. In this day and age.
Thankfully it's gone now, but it made me angry every single day.

I had to do reserch on Flake ads over the decades for a Retail Assessment. They are targeted to women and yet so suggestive to men.
*nods* I know exactly what you mean.

In Australia a juice ad was pulled off air because it objectified a man. Yet women are still used as sexual objects to sell products.
Men being 'the stronger sex' is a joke. I'd like to see them cope with what women put up with on a daily basis.

Thanks for your sympathy.
I've always had cats, I know how hard it is to lose them. (((hugs)))

[cynthia2015.livejournal.com]

I saw how devastating it was for my brother to go through a divorce. Despite that, he wants me to find happiness. His just being cautious on my behalf.

I watched a show years ago where an experiment was done on guys being objectified by girls. At first the guys like it, but after a while it started to make them feel bad.

My cat was a grey tabby and I had him for 13 years. I still have another cat. I'm sure she's missing him too. But I'm coping alright now.

[elisi]

Sorry this reply is so late! Life just ran away from me...

I saw how devastating it was for my brother to go through a divorce. Despite that, he wants me to find happiness. His just being cautious on my behalf.
He sounds like a good brother.

I watched a show years ago where an experiment was done on guys being objectified by girls. At first the guys like it, but after a while it started to make them feel bad.
Not surprising...

My cat was a grey tabby and I had him for 13 years. I still have another cat. I'm sure she's missing him too. But I'm coping alright now.
<3 I'm glad you have another cat, I'm hoping you get lots of snuggles.

[cynthia2015.livejournal.com]

That's alright. I know how it is.

When a match make didn't work out, my brother took it harder than me. But it was best to know where I stood before things went further. The guy went for someone else because I took "too long" to make arrangements.

The cat I have now is part tabby, part tortoiseshell. Shes more "streetwise".

[elisi]

But it was best to know where I stood before things went further. The guy went for someone else because I took "too long" to make arrangements.
Seems it all ended up the best way possible. If you weren't ready, rushing it would have been awful.

And your cat sounds adorable.

[cynthia2015.livejournal.com]

Whats more awkward is when I'm in a situation with where I have to make small talk and I get ask why I'm not in a relationship.

I always have to bring up my personal background with being a carer, then I have to mention my dad etc. I just wish I could talk about something a bit more uplifting when I socialise.

It's going to be hard to find someone who can accept that I come with that kind of baggage.

Anyway.

Cats are funny when they are hyper, as my cat can be quite mischievous.

[elisi]

Whats more awkward is when I'm in a situation with where I have to make small talk and I get ask why I'm not in a relationship.
I wish society wouldn't put such a premium on being a couple. Better to be single, than an unhappy couple. Plus there are a lot of single people...

I always have to bring up my personal background with being a carer, then I have to mention my dad etc. I just wish I could talk about something a bit more uplifting when I socialise.
Smalltalk is evil.

Cats are funny when they are hyper, as my cat can be quite mischievous.
Cats are one of the best entertainments possible.

[cynthia2015.livejournal.com]

"Smalltalk is evil".

I like your way of thinking.:)

I think you shouldn't have to try so hard when making friends. It just happens naturally.

[elisi]

I think you shouldn't have to try so hard when making friends. It just happens naturally.
This.