Always the same 'ship, just with different couples...

[elisi]

I've been re-reading Gaudy Night (like you do), and one sentence suddenly stood out. Well a lot of them did, obviously, because it's a wonderful book, but I've been thinking about how Peter and Harriet are my 'shipping blueprint, and there is was, perfectly:

That, then, was what he wanted her for. For some reason, obscure to herself and probably also to him, she had the power to force him outside his defences.

Because that is it - the thing that runs through every couple I've ever shipped. Buffy/Spike (although there it is him forcing her out of her defences), Jack/Ianto, Doctor/River, and - with a slight variation, in that these couples are also very old - Spike/Angel and Doctor/Master. Heck you can add Cutter/Leetah to that list, and Howl/Sophie - or even Elizabeth/Darcy... (um, not me. The Austen version.)

To quote the book again (it makes more sense in context - there's poetry involved - but I think it works on its own):

He did not want to forget, or to be quiet, or to be spared things, or to stay put. All he wanted was some kind of central stability, and he was apparently ready to take anything that came along, so long as it stimulated him to keep that precarious balance.

It's not about the strength of their [~romantic~] feelings (how *do* you measure love, anyway?), or about making each other happy; indeed a lot of my 'ships have at various points tried to kill each other. But that connection is still there, that ability to force honesty from each other:

"And I can fool Giles, and I can fool my friends, but I can't fool myself. Or Spike, for some reason."

"It's not pretty, but it's real."

I could go on, but I think this speaks for itself pretty well. All thoughts welcome.

(promethia_tenk have you finished it yet? *looks hopeful* My ear is open like a greedy shark to catch the tunings of a voice divine...)

Comments

[elisi]

But taken as a whole I feel like they fall down a bit, and as a study of Moffat's writing, I want to know why . . . .
See this is why I like you so much. Most people (or rather, most fannish people) just tend to complain when something's wrong. Trying to work out *why* is so much more productive and sensible. :)

And all these things happen along this very linear and same-y storyline, and yet they don't cohere. I don't think he really knows how to make those links smooth.
Hmmm. Interesting. I shall have to ponder this.

At any rate. I don't think they're horrible episodes or anything. I quite like them. But I like his other episodes better. Actually, I rather like the Angels episodes for showing up why his other episodes work so well--and I think it's because he embraces the jumps and goes for broke with them. . . . and, this comment has now earned the rambling icon.
Rambling is good. I can't count the number of things I've worked out as I wrote. (You get my favourite new icon because it makes me smile.)

Glower all you want, Ten--the point stands.
He does glower well, though, doesn't he? ;)

Excellent. I ADORED the class I took on baroque architecture--it was like several months' vacation in Rome but with bonus mind-twist-y-ness.
Mmmmm. I'm jealous now.

You live in the same country and you have not been?!?!? tsk ;-)
Well it's that thing of when you can (in theory) go whenever you want, you don't get round to it. Plus it's a whole different story once you've got kids...

His wife, who is in the same field, skipped the lecture to go see the King's College Chapel instead. He understood--he wanted to do the same.
In one of my fics I have the characters (who are studying in Cambridge) going in and looking around... *wistful sigh*

[promethia_tenk]

See this is why I like you so much. Most people (or rather, most fannish people) just tend to complain when something's wrong. Trying to work out *why* is so much more productive and sensible. :)
Ah, now that is very gratifying, thank you. It's . . . a compulsion, really. Anything that bugs is a sign of something deeper to be found out--complaining mostly gets in the way. I gather I ruin other people's fun, though ;-)

Err . . . and let us pretend that I didn't recently succumb to a fit of RTD-inspired peak over on doctoreleven. We all have out limits. /chagrined

FWIW, I like that you are a constant source of delight and edification.

Rambling is good. I can't count the number of things I've worked out as I wrote.
You know, the longer I spend in internet communities, the more I find this true for myself--and it surprised me. Writing formally, it's all so very controlled that there isn't much room for discovery. The constant unregulated back and forth online, though, it's like . . . an unending deluge of new ideas. I was never really one to develop my thoughts on paper--if I write them down for myself, all it does is mirror what's in my head anyway, which was always more than enough to cover whatever paper or project needed doing, so I didn't concern myself with it. But always having people to write to, as one does on the internet, even when it's just brainstorming . . . *BOOM*

I don't think I would want to go back to the old way or working.

(You get my favourite new icon because it makes me smile.)
Haha! Nice. I love the expression on his face for some reason.

He does glower well, though, doesn't he? ;)
He is the master of the glower, there is no doubt.

In one of my fics I have the characters (who are studying in Cambridge) going in and looking around... *wistful sigh*
!!!!!!! Really? Awesome.

[elisi]

Ah, now that is very gratifying, thank you. It's . . . a compulsion, really. Anything that bugs is a sign of something deeper to be found out--complaining mostly gets in the way. I gather I ruin other people's fun, though ;-)
But there is nothing more delightful than working out *why* something does what it does... Some people have a strange notion of fun...

Err . . . and let us pretend that I didn't recently succumb to a fit of RTD-inspired peak over on doctoreleven. We all have out limits. /chagrined
Hee! Well that was a rant against a specific trait of his writing, something you can either like or dislike, but not one that you can really analyse. (Well I sort of tried, but it was more an analysis of his writing than a defense.)

You know, the longer I spend in internet communities, the more I find this true for myself--and it surprised me
It's interesting, because I came from the other side of things. That is - I lurked for a good while, and found a lot of very insightful fic/meta and the conversations that they generated. So when I began writing myself I was very aware of the two-way dialogue of the whole thing. There is nothing so gratifying as good feedback, esp since it often leads to new inspiration.

But always having people to write to, as one does on the internet, even when it's just brainstorming . . . *BOOM*
I love it to bits. Even though sometimes you get arguments that just go on and on and on and that gets VERY tiring. (I don't mean trolls or anything like that, just people who have a different POV and who will never ever change.)

I don't think I would want to go back to the old way or working.
This is why I have a beta - to be able to bounce ideas off someone (esp if it's someone who knows you well) is priceless.

Haha! Nice. I love the expression on his face for some reason.
When I went looking for screencaps, that one just stood out. He looks serious, but you know that mischief is just round the corner, I think. :)

He is the master of the glower, there is no doubt.
Also, he has very pretty eyes.

!!!!!!! Really? Awesome.
I can give you a link, but it's buried deep in my long AU WIP... ETA: Also it's very brief. But neat. :)

[promethia_tenk]

But there is nothing more delightful than working out *why* something does what it does... Some people have a strange notion of fun...
People are so very attached to their opinions, and tend not to take it well when you confront them with reality ;-) Ah well, more fun for us . . .

Well that was a rant against a specific trait of his writing, something you can either like or dislike, but not one that you can really analyse. (Well I sort of tried, but it was more an analysis of his writing than a defense.)
Oh, you can analyze anything (and I do). Defending, however, is an entirely different matter. As you say, though, that is simply Rusty, and it is unlikely to change.

That is - I lurked for a good while, and found a lot of very insightful fic/meta and the conversations that they generated. So when I began writing myself I was very aware of the two-way dialogue of the whole thing.
I haven't expressed myself clearly. I too was always conscious of the collaborative, dialogue aspect of online culture and the creativity that that inspires, and it was definitely one of the things that drew me in. What surprised me was the discovering ideas through writing--the things that come to you mid-sentence. That never happened to me much before, which was why I've spent most of my life just planning essays in my head. I was always very confused by suggestions about simply starting writing or brainstorming on paper--it never amounted to anything. The more time I spend online, though, the more those mid-sentence ideas happen. Somehow the fact of actively trying to communicate something to someone--even when you don't know what it is yet--makes the difference. Whereas if I was just doing it for myself . . . nada.

Even though sometimes you get arguments that just go on and on and on and that gets VERY tiring.
I'm slowly learning to just drop these as soon as I recognize them. No point in butting my head against a brick wall. There's someone on my flist I've essentially instituted a "one response" rule for. Although admittedly she really does seem determined to be contrary.

When I went looking for screencaps, that one just stood out. He looks serious, but you know that mischief is just round the corner, I think. :)
Yes!

I can give you a link, but it's buried deep in my long AU WIP... ETA: Also it's very brief. But neat. :)
Yeah . . . I'd like to see it. /geek

[elisi]

People are so very attached to their opinions, and tend not to take it well when you confront them with reality ;-) Ah well, more fun for us . . .
Indeed. :)

Oh, you can analyze anything (and I do). Defending, however, is an entirely different matter. As you say, though, that is simply Rusty, and it is unlikely to change.
*nods* Like I always say, it helped that I came from the world of Joss, who writes very similarly, although usually he has a team of writers who manage to fill most of the plotholes. :)

I haven't expressed myself clearly. I too was always conscious of the collaborative, dialogue aspect of online culture and the creativity that that inspires, and it was definitely one of the things that drew me in. What surprised me was the discovering ideas through writing--the things that come to you mid-sentence.
Oh I've got you now. Yes. I'm trying to cast my mind back, but it's all such a long time since I started out that I can't remember what happened. ;)

There's someone on my flist I've essentially instituted a "one response" rule for. Although admittedly she really does seem determined to be contrary.
I've got someone like that too...

Yeah . . . I'd like to see it. /geek
Went and had a look and decided to just do a cut and paste. The start of the fic in question is here (and you can find the whole verse here! You know how I can't do short? This 'verse is the proof...), but this is from the beginning of chapter 4, and - as you can see - very short indeed. Should probably mention that they're both 1st year Physics students and not very artistically inclined, and at this point only friends. ;) (Wildly AU verse, did I mention? 'Alex' is Alexander Saxon, son of the former prime minister, and the girl is called Allison. She's rather intrigued by her peculiar classmate.)

~~~

Only last week Alex had asked her to come ‘exploring’ with him, and they’d ended up in King’s College chapel. It had been the strangest experience, since he’d done a pretty good impression of her father – a history teacher through and through - running this way and that, pointing out historical oddities and getting very excited.

When she admitted not being terribly fond of history, he’d looked at her as if she was mad, and declared history to be the greatest subject in the world.

“So, why aren’t you studying history?” she’d asked, perfectly logically, and there had been a pause.

"Mostly because the courses are way too restrictive," the reply had finally been, and, before she had been able to explore the subject further, the organ had suddenly started playing, and Alex’s face had lit up, as if illuminated from above by a light bulb.

Then he’d dragged her up to the organ loft and somehow – Allison still wasn’t quite sure – talked the organist into giving him an impromptu lesson.

Any doubts that she might previously have had about his claim to be able to turn his hand to anything had been swiftly blown away, as in less than an hour he mastered the instrument. Having witnessed a seemingly never-ending stream of piano students traipse through the front door during her childhood - and still vividly remembering her own, less than enthusiastic, lessons - his feat impressed her more than she let on.

But most surprising of all had been the fact that once he'd got the hang of it, he thanked the stunned organist profusely, and then got up and left, his interest already elsewhere.