elisi | Awww, bitty Buffy...

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episode thoughts

Awww, bitty Buffy...

Funnily enough we watched Buffy last night... shiny new DVDs are fun! :) Also had a look at a few extras, one of which is Hepburn's video to 'I Quit'. Darcy's comment I think was something like "Great - they're all bossy dykes!" Which they are - the song is pretty much about breaking up with their goth/vamp 'doubles'... still a good song though! *g*

Anyway, decided to just start at the beginning and therefore watched WttH and 'The Harvest'.
Of course they're all so YOUNG and SWEET and Buffy is very much a living proof of why Slayers need a Watcher. (And Giles is so adorable! ::squishes him::). But Buffy is very much your typical teen - so snippy with Giles, although she automatically gravitates towards him. She's hurting from what slaying has done to her (left her friendless and alone), but her heart still shines through, in that if someone needs help she can't stop herself. But no matter how sweet she is, I still prefer her later - she's very... straightforward here. I prefer her with layers - like an ogre. *g*

Angel looks *very* pretty (Darcy: "I'd forgotten how skinny he was then.He really filled out later!"), and the first look (shadowy outline) is very James Dean. But the clothes are horrible (that shiny jacket? A whole new world of badness!) and the acting possibly worse. That he turned into my beloved Angel from AtS is... nothing short of miraculous!

The Master is entertainingly camp and I rather liked Luke (So ugly, so evil). Darla... ah Darla. Sometimes excellent, other times so wrong considering how they fleshed out her character later. My current theory is that The Master did some sort of spell on her to keep her in line (no running off with handsome young rebels any more). ETA: Oh and I'd forgotten that she's the one who picks out Cordy to be Luke's next victim in The Bronze... no wonder she is so particularly angry with her in AtS S2!

Willow is mostly just cute - the main thing I noticed was actually the Jesse & Xander story line. Jesse isn't mentioned much later in the show, but I think what happened to him has a very big psychological effect on Xander. They have this exchange, before Xander (accidentally) dusts him:
Xander: Jesse! I know there's still a part of you in there.
Jesse: Okay... Let's deal with this. Jesse was an excruciating loser who couldn't get a date with anyone in the sighted
community! Look at me. I'm a new man!
Pretty much all of his singleminded hatred of vampires can be led back to what happened to Jesse - vampires killed his (best) friend and turned him into an evil, callous stranger. There's probably an essay in there somewhere.

ETA: And yet Jesse uses the word 'I' ("I'm a new man") - it also reminded me of Willow's way of describing herself when she went evil. Hmmm.

Don't have time for much more. But I'll try to write down my thoughts after each episode. Loved all sorts of bits and pieces - Flutie taping Buffy's report back together, 'Ballad for Dead Friends', Giles slamming down the 'Vampyr' book... *happy sigh*

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I totally agree about Jesse. I think he's never mentioned again in the series after the Harvest, but I'm sure that his death shapes all of Xander's interactions with vampires (esp. Angel and Spike) after that.

I haven't written an essay about it, but I have written a scene into a fic ... unfortunately it's part of the never-posted, unfinished, indefinitely on hiatus sequel to "London Calling."

So, what the heck, I'll post it here! (The first part is a dream, not an AU, by the way)

***

Xander was in the alley behind the Bronze, and it was dark. He had a stake in his hand, but there weren't any vampires in sight.

He turned around and saw Jesse. "Hey, buddy," Jesse said with a grin, "what's up?"

He felt nervous, but he couldn't remember why. "Nothing. Hey, I think the new girl's inside, dancing."

"I am so going to score with her. Did you see the way she was looking at me earlier? Hey - could you just tell me if my hair looks all right? It's the weirdest thing, I can't use mirrors anymore."

"You're a vampire." Xander stumbled a step backwards, and gripped the stake so tight it hurt.

"Well, duh!" Jesse slipped into game face and out again, laughing. "That's why I know I'm going to score with her. Haven't you noticed how much cooler and sexier vampires are than loser high school boys?"

He looked surprised when Xander slammed him up against the wall of the Bronze and pressed the stake against his chest.

"Hey," he said in a small, hurt voice. "I thought we were friends?"

"You're not my friend," Xander intoned, knowing it was a quote from somewhere. "You're the thing that killed him."

"You're just saying that so you don't have to give me back my skateboard and the Death of Superman trade paperback," Jesse muttered petulantly. "Jerk." And he exploded into dust.

***

Xander woke up with a chalky, choking taste in his mouth and throat. He tried to breathe but he gagged, and he fell off the cot in a tangle of blankets and barely made it across the hall to the bathroom in time to throw up.

***

"What the fuck are you doing here?" Spike asked, frowning at Xander for a long moment before he opened the door enough to let him in. He was wearing the black jeans from before and a wrinkled grey t-shirt, and his breath smelled of booze. "It's five thirty in the bloody a.m."

"Couldn't sleep. Came to ask you a question." He stepped inside, and fingered the stake hidden in his pocket while he waited for Spike to push the door closed. Then, as Spike was turning back towards him, he shot out a hand to shove Spike against the wall and pin him there. Xander's forearm pressed hard against Spike's chest and he took his other hand out of his pocket, held the stake in easy view.

Spike's eyes were wide. "What the fuck?"

"Who's the first human you killed, Spike?"

"Christ, Harris, you're—you're not drunk." He finished the sentence more quietly than he started it. "But you've just been sick."

Xander felt weirdly weak all of a sudden, so he let go of Spike and sat on the floor. "You can smell that? God. Ew. I rinsed my mouth out and everything."

Spike limped over to the bar fridge and grabbed an open bottle from on top of it. "Here, this'll kill the aftertaste, and you look like you could use it."

Xander accepted the half-empty bottle of rum and took a cautious swig.

"So mind telling me what the burst-in-and-threaten-me bit was about? Thought we were past all that." Spike sat down a few careful feet out of Xander's reach, with his injured leg stuck out straight in front of him.

Xander closed his eyes and felt the rum burn its way down. "I had a bad dream. Just answer the fucking question, would you?"

"First person I ever killed? I don't fucking remember. It was a bloody long time ago."

"Wrong answer."

"What, you know something I don't? I swear to the thousand hells, Harris, I don't remember. The first few weeks after Dru turned me I went fucking wild. It's nothing but fragments I can get back now - not much more than the crunch of bones breaking under my fists and the taste of blood."

"You'd remember him." Xander opened his eyes. "You're wearing his body."

Spike blinked. "Huh?"

"What was his name?"

"Who?...oh. You mean...bloody hell." Spike pinched the bridge of his nose in a weary gesture. "My real name is William, all right? Hand me that sodding bottle."

"His name was William," Xander corrected in a voice that didn't quite break. "William the Bloody?"

"Had the nickname before I met Dru, yeah. Didn't mean what you think it means."

"What was he like?"

"I was a complete ponce, actually."

"Um, does that translate into American as 'excruciating loser'?"

"Well." Spike blinked. "Yeah, close enough."

"Then that's exactly what he said." Xander closed his eyes against the ringing sound, and took another drink.

He didn't register Spike's question until he felt Spike's hand on his arm. "Who are you talking about?"

Spike was still keeping arm's length away, he saw when he opened his eyes. "Giles said - 'You're not looking at your friend. You're looking at the thing that killed him.'"

Spike's hand slipped off Xander's arm, and Spike backed off almost imperceptibly. "You had a friend, and he got turned."

"And I staked him." Tears pricked Xander's eyes, but he slammed the bottle down on the floor and shouted at Spike, "But it wasn't Jesse! I didn't kill Jesse! He was already dead, nothing was left but the fucking demon walking around in his body!"

"And I'm not William, I'm the demon that killed him?"

"Yes!"

"So if I remember playing toy soldiers in the nursery when I was five and getting strapped for forgetting my Latin when I was ten and all that rot - what, that never happened to me?"

He couldn't answer the question. He couldn't think about the question. "They all said it, over and over. 'Xander, you didn't kill Jesse.'" He was pleading, begging Spike for something, and he didn't know what but he was pretty sure he couldn't survive if he didn't get it.

"Xander," Spike's voice was hollow and far away, "You killed Jesse."

That was it.

The smell of rum was strong and Xander's pants were wet and the bottle was rolling on its side where Spike had knocked it over. His arms were around Xander and Xander was sobbing.

"You killed Jesse," he repeated, whispering it in an incongruously soothing tone while he stroked Xander's hair. "You killed your friend Jesse."

Aaaaaaw, that's heartbreaking. (I am allergic to S/X, but that was brilliant!)

I love fic that explores stuff in that way - and this was very well done. It's funny, because I've just read a review of 'Doppelgangland' and been thinking about the Vamp!Willow problem - they choose to send her back because they can't stake her. Also:
Buffy: Willow, just remember, a vampire's personality has nothing to do with the person it was.
Angel: (without thinking) Well, actually... (gets a look from Buffy) That's a good point.
It's a grey area! I don't think that Spike is right in your story necessarily, but he isn't wrong either.

How much do I love this 'verse... *happy sigh*

Thank you so much for sharing! :)

Heh, I just noticed that I posted this under my non-fic username. Oh well, you know who I am, right?

I did remember you aren't so much down with the S/X, but I hoped this would be okay, being limited to hugging. :)

The Vamp!Willow thing is troubling to me, too. Why does the Willow vampire deserve more consideration than any other vampire? Isn't her killing people in the Wishverse just as bad as her killing people in their version of Sunnydale?

I can sort of justify it, though, thinking that they were engaging in a Prime Directive (ala Star Trek) thinking regarding the Wishverse; vamp!Willow belongs in that universe and has to play out her role there free of extra-dimensional interference.

Buffy: Willow, just remember, a vampire's personality has nothing to do with the person it was.
Angel: (without thinking) Well, actually... (gets a look from Buffy) That's a good point.

Yeah, I think that's a really key moment for our understanding of the relationship between a vampire and the human who was turned ... but of course the frustrating thing is, we never find out what Angel was originally going to say! From his tone it was clear he was going to contradict Buffy, but in what way exactly?

These questions interest me. As you can probably tell. :)

Giles' original description of what it's like to be turned (the person is gone and it's a demon walking around in their body, even if the demon has the person's memories) really doesn't seem to entirely agree with what we later learn of Spike's history, and what we see Harmony go through. On the other hand it seems to be a perfect description of what happens to Fred when Illyria takes over.

I don't think that Spike is right in your story necessarily, but he isn't wrong either.

Well, he has a slightly biased perspective, of course!

Actually, the scene continues beyond what I posted here, and Spike does refine his position on the question a bit more. The later part has more plot-specific exposition, so I didn't want to post it, but hm, maybe I can just snip the relevant bits (again, this is in lieu of an essay on my thoughts on this question!) Um, here:

***

Eventually the tears stopped and a weary calmness sank through Xander. He knew he was a disgusting snotty mess, so when Spike handed him a bloodstained t-shirt and said "clean yourself up," he wiped his eyes and blew his nose on it, barely conscious of the multiple levels of ew factor.

"We should have done something to save him," he said, and he didn't even mean it in a self-recriminatory way - it was just such an amazing wash of relief to finally admit it.

But - "No," said Spike. "You couldn't have. You had to dust him."

"Because vampires are evil?" Xander glared at him and tossed the t-shirt at some corner. "Like you and Angel?"

"Pretty much, yeah," Spike agreed easily. "Not like you had a gypsy curse or a government pain chip to hand, right? And even if you did, that's not the kind of thing you do to a friend. Better to just dust him, make a clean end of it."

"We could have - it was Jesse. We could have done something."

"He would have killed you. If he got away he would've killed plenty more people - that's what vampires do, innit? He was your friend, yeah, but he was a monster, too."

"Willow turned into a monster and I didn't kill her," Xander said in a voice so small he could barely hear himself. "Anya, too."

[...]

Spike shifted, put his elbow on his knee. "So. You finished telling me the story of Scoobies gone bad?" He caught Xander's glare at the light tone. "Hey, reformed mass murderer myself, you know."

"See, that's the point. You reformed. Willow got through it. Anya gave up her powers. But we never gave Jesse a chance."

Spike lit up another cigarette before answering - it was the fourth he'd smoked since Xander started talking. "Look, Buffy tried to dust me more than once, and she was bloody well right to do it - just too bad for all the poor sods I killed afterwards that she failed. And from what you just told me, she was ready to kill Willow and Anya, too, when it looked like she had to to protect the innocent. Maybe none of the three of us should be walking this earth. But fate's a capricious bitch, so here we are."

Yes I knew it was you! *g* (And even if I didn't, there's no one else who'd post Spander in my journal!)

As before, very interesting and this I could actually see happening! Thank you!

These questions are what makes me love the show so much!

vamp!Willow belongs in that universe and has to play out her role there free of extra-dimensional interference.
Yes that's my take on it too - and also I think that since they have a way out, they take it. Jesse was killed by accident - although Buffy might have staked him eventually, like she had to stake Angelus. But they never stake Harmony - and let Spike live in S4 'because they know him'. Personal attachments play an important role!

Re. how much remains of the original person, then I think it's variable. (Otherwise nothing makes sense. *g*) It also raises questions about the demons that inhabit the body - where do they come from? What are they like before? How much of their personality shines though?

And now my head is beginning to hurt...

But I love your point about Illyria/Fred. I'd never thought of that.

I think Illyria/Fred makes a really good contrast to the vampire question, because it seems completely clear that Illyria is not Fred.

The Scooby gang has a serious tendency to value the lives of people they know over those of people they don't. Sometimes it gets downright troubling.

It also raises questions about the demons that inhabit the body - where do they come from? What are they like before? How much of their personality shines though?

All of which are very unanswered questions! :D

Personally I've come to the conclusion (decision?) that the demons are "born" in the people at the moment of turning (vampire reproduction). The demon doesn't really have an separate existence, it's just a new part of the person. It doesn't have memories of its own, or a personality per se, but it does have a whole wack of instincts and impulses.

Anyway, that seems to mostly work with what we see in canon!

I don't know that Illyria/Fred is that clear cut.

Illyria knows everything about being Fred enough to fool her own parents. Illyria never felt guilt or affection at all before being born into Fred, but Illyria in Fred feels them stringly enough to be dominated by Fred's emotions more often than not.

On the other hand, the Fred/Illyria relationship is not the same as the vamping relationship.

We usually see vampires pervert the stronest feelings of the human and dissolve the superego entirely. Illyria keeps those strongest feelings as the only ones that remain just as strong.

Of course we have no other Illyrias to compare. And we know the variability of Liam/ vamp Liam, William/ vamp William, Anne/ vamp Anne, Willow/ vamp Willow, and Lawson/ vamp Lawson provides abundant material to reach any conclusion you like.

it seems completely clear that Illyria is not Fred.
Exactly. She can do a Fred impersonation (and with time she begins to understand Fred's feelings), but unlike say Spike and Angelus she feels no ties to the people Fred was close to.

Sometimes it gets downright troubling.
I know what you mean, but I think it's a very human tendendy - if there was trouble we'd all save our own family first I think.

Your 'demons are born' theory is very interesting. I like it a lot! :) Must ponder.

Gah.. I would enjoy reading this for certain. And I'm not even interested in Spander.

Well, I'm glad you enjoyed this bit, and thanks for saying so!

You probably wouldn't like the story as a whole, though—it's very Spandery.

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Awww, bitty Buffy...

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