Help...

[elisi]

VM is teh crack. Whatever will I do when we've finished watching Season 1? Anyway, now I need an icon of Veronica and Logan's first kiss! :) (Feeling slightly sorry for her 'proper' boyfriend though - Leo is it? - he's sweet and all but strikes me as a bit Riley-like. Ah well, all must bow to the mighty pull of superior chemistry! *g*) Oh and don't spoil me!

And I *will* get round to replying to comments soon. Promise!

ETA: I should probably change my tag-line to 'Defender of unpoplar fandom opinions'. I am thisclose to writing about the alley-scene in DT. But I'm not going to. Yet anyway. (So hold your fire, OK?)

Comments

[http://users.livejournal.com/_jems_/]

You know what? At this point I think there are enough icons of that first kiss around so as to make spoiler-cuts pretty redundant. *g*

But if you're looking for icons you can always try veronica_icons.

I'd like to read your take on the alley scene. Personally, I don't get why people would think that it excuses Buffy's action just because Spike tells her to lay it on him. I mean, it makes it less of an offense, but it doesn't excuse it entirely.

[elisi]

Yeah I was debating whether or not to cut, but then LJ ettiquette won out. *g*

Thanks for the link. Will check it out, although your icon is very, very lovely!

I don't think it excuses it either, but I don't think that the fact that she beats him up is an excuse to hate her. It's all very complicated, but I *think* I'll try to write Valentines schmoop first!

[http://users.livejournal.com/_jems_/]

Erring on the side of caution in LJ etiquette matters is always the prudent choice.

If you want to use the icon, go ahead, I put it up for sharing ages ago. =)

I don't think it excuses it either, but I don't think that the fact that she beats him up is an excuse to hate her.
Oh, I agree, but there are those who seem to think that Buffy does nothing wrong in giving Spike that beating (though that seems to just be the Spike haters, so...), and that I just don't understand. She may not be violating Spike, because he does know exactly what she's doing and invites her to continue, but she's violating herself by doing it.

I also think it's the one event that makes it painfully clear just how mutually destructive they were, and that Spike isn't the only one who has done something that needs to be forgiven when season 7 rolls around.

[elisi]

She may not be violating Spike, because he does know exactly what she's doing and invites her to continue, but she's violating herself by doing it.
OMG that is my point *exactly*! Actually everything you said! Yay - I won't have to write it now. *g*

[fishsanwitt]

I'd love to read your alley scene as well.

::hug::

[elisi]

Hmmm, well maybe sometime next week... Must.Find.Time...

[femmenerd.livejournal.com]

I wouldn't hurt you--I'd be interested in how you dealt with such a charged scene. Where Buffy--like Faith during the bodyswitch--is projecting her own anger at herself onto someone else.

[elisi]

'Charged' is a good word. I know that a lot of people ended up hating Buffy, which is something I never understood. Hmmm, maybe next week I'll manage to find some time?

[fangfaceandrea.livejournal.com]

Hmmm the Alley scene never really bothered me as much as it did the majority of the people on the fandom, I mean it's hard to watch and heavy emotionally But it didn't send me to the path of Buffy-hate. Can't wait to see what's your take on it :D

[elisi]

Will *have* to do it now, won't I? But I'll have to figure it all out in my head though first!

[ringthebells]

Omg, Leo is totally Riley-like! I hadn't thought of that before, but it's so true.

Or maybe I just think that because they're both fine, upstanding young men who get to walk around armed.

[elisi]

they're both fine, upstanding young men who get to walk around armed.
Hee. So true. ;)

[mikeygs.livejournal.com]

I should probably change my tag-line to 'Defender of unpoplar fandom opinions'.

You should. :) You could get a graphic like molly_may's Buffy aficionado one.

Ah, the much debated alley scene. You know one thing that always strikes me is how many posts, essays, whatever, you find about Seeing Red, not nearly as many analyze DT. That's just Buffy beating up her boyfriend, which she did all the time and out of pure enjoyment, of course. Is it right, what happened? Hell, no. But in some weird, twisted Buffy/Spike way, it isn't wrong, either. It's something that happens between them and they're both at fault, IMO, him goading her into it and her for letting herself be goaded. Yes, it's more her fault than his. If anything, it evinces what's wrong between them. I just feel sorry for both of them there.

That said, I never thought it was that big of a deal, certainly not something that needed to be eeked out over a season and a half. I'm sorry, I like Spike, but DT and SR are in no way equatable, in my view.

[elisi]

And again I can only say that you've pretty much summed up my feelings exactly. It's people like the ones who set up fall_for_spike that I cannot fathom. From the user info page:
5) Also, because it's our community, we have decided to disallow any and all Spike/Buffy pairings from being posted. No fic, wallpapers or manips - nothing. If anyone thinks this is unfair and wants to argue the point, go watch the alley scene at the end of "Dead Things" and you may then understand our reasoning. Any and all other pairings are allowed: slash, het, cement blocks, bestiality, whatever - just no Spuffy.
Because WTF? I think I *will* write my alley scene post - but I'll have to wait until I have a little more time!

[mikeygs.livejournal.com]

Heh. I'd forgotten about that community. The funniest part about it is that it's only Buffy that's singled out. I mean, who hasn't slighted Spike or been slighted by him? Why is it OK to ship Spike/Anya or Spike/Faith after he (attempts to) smack them around? Or Angel after the Poker Incident? And of course there's Xander. I find the whole thing funny.

:) Hope things ease up on you a bit soon. :)

[elisi]

Well I barely knew of it - only one person on my flist wrote something for it as far as I know. To my delight it was a fabulously nasty Spawn story, with a Spike so unpleasant that a staking would be far too easy a death! ;)

Anyway, it's now the half-term holidays, so I'm looking forward to a week of not having to get up early! Yay!

[zimshan.livejournal.com]

HAHA! You've gotten to the crack aspect! Congrats!

I've got an embarrassing amount of VM icons in my userpics, especially Lg/VM ones, so you're more than welcome to look through them. Though you might want to wait until you've seen the finale. I assume you've only gotten to 18 at the moment?

[elisi]

Watched 19 last night... I think, it's hard to keep track. Although I think we'll be done before the end of the weekend and then I will definitely have a thorough look through your icons! Thanks. :)