The Impossible Astronaut. DW S 6.1

[elisi]

This review was near-impossible to write, so I’m just throwing some stuff out there, and you can make of it what you want. The problem is that EVERYTHING ties in with EVERYTHING ELSE and whenever I try to write it down my head dies from meta. No really. I’d need some kind of three dimensional diagram to properly illustrate my thoughts.

Instead you’ll get a brief look into my head - with illustrations!

To begin with:


(For the non-Brits among you: Carry On was a long-running series of low-budget British comedy films. They are an energetic mix of parody, farce, slapstick and double entendres. Perfectly illustrated in this 20 second clip from Carry On Camping)

Actually can I just say that I love Amy and Rory to itty bitty little pieces and that I flail at everything they do? Because I won’t be talking about them much, since they don’t generate that much meta... Although I *will* say that as someone who married age 20, and had her first child at 22, I cannot off the top of my head think of any other show that has had anything similar, ever, and certainly not portrayed it as a good and positive thing. Random fandom people who lay into Amy’s choices: Those were MY choices too, and I have not ever regretted them, not for a second. Are we clear? (ETA: This is not so much about the pregnancy (or whatever it is), as the 'getting married young', because the criticisms irk me.)

Other random observations:

The music playing at the very, very end when Amy shoots the astronaut/little girl is The Life And Death Of Amy Pond - one of my favourite pieces of music ever.

The music playing on the radio in the diner when older!Doctor and River compare diaries is Adele's Rolling In The Deep. This KILLED me.

I adore Canton Everett Delaware the Third, and am desperately hoping that he brings along The Gay Agenda once more.

The Doctor/River flirting was just OFF THE SCALE! If I had the time I'd list every line they spoke...

Vid rec: Who Wants To Live Forever.

***

Well then, onto the meta. There’ll be a lot of River now, because she is River, and she winds her way through the Doctor’s life and times and metaphors in ways that are just *ridiculous*...

And, like I’ve said before, calapine’s What the Doormouse Said informs pretty much all of my thinking here. This bit especially:

(There are contradictions in the narrative; someone has been doing a great deal of rewriting.)

Everything that exists should be as real as everything else.

The first - obviously - pertains to Eleven’s death here. It is a blantant contradiction to what we know of Doctor Who - both on a Doylist and a Watsonian level. And yet - it happened. The Doctor really died, and it was real. Even if it is unmade, doesn’t make it less real, here.

The Doctor died, and there were no comedy vultures, no overwrought despair. Just a man, gathering his friends for one last time, and then meeting his final adventure head-on.

It was A Good Death, and it was perfect and I loved it.

And...



You see? Everything is tied up in big round circles. What’s happening has happened before, will happen again. Remember the Comic Relief Special? The whole ‘verse is like that. Everything reflected back, mirrored, layers upon layers upon layers, every puzzle piece adding another facet, another interpretation...

Which brings me to River’s speech. It’s heartbreaking, and also somewhat troublesome, but - as everyone has pointed out - she’s had a really, really bad day. She’s gone from being the person the Doctor trusts the most in the whole universe (himself apart... oh Jim the Fish!), to having all her motives questioned. Plus she’s in prison (voluntarily, but still) - is it any wonder she rues days to come and tries to cling on to every scrap of the man she loves? (There's even a vid that's that speech to a T: Gravity. Made back in August last year...)

Now several things ameliorate this for me - one, when she gets out of prison (for good), she doesn’t sit around wringing her hands. She gets her professorship and finds a little team of her own (Anita, the Daves) and goes off on her own adventures. No pointless pining - River is a woman of action.

Two, she describes the times when she first met the Doctor, how wonderful it was - but of course he was then at the point she is now. Loving someone dearly who barely knew him... (And really, do you think she fell into his arms? Ten certainly didn't fall into her arms.)

Third, it puts a different slant on her ending. Like so:



Her final end is not that tear-stained goodbye to a man who doesn’t know her yet. It’s a loving confirmation from the man who trusts her completely: Yes, he was always there to catch her.

Plus, her role as story teller in The Library again ties in with 'What The Dormouse Said':

Sometimes River wonders if the Doctor is a figment of her imagination.

[...]

She invented him; she can’t tell him that, what if he doesn’t believe her? What if he unmakes her? Why make him so unhappy? Why make his world burn?

What is real, what is not? A story only dies if it’s forgotten or lost, and that is her greatest fear... And that is what the Silence represents, the terror underpinning the whole narrative. You look away, you forget. People, stories, erased from the world.

Anyway, I don't think it's River who kills him. Well it might be, but if so it's a future!River, and the Doctor is certainly not the man she goes to prison for killing. Still, I'll leave you with this, because the visual parallels in this show are so gorgeous I get all speechless:



("You said you were in the library!"
"So was the swimming pool!")

Stories, water (River), a space 'man' who's not what you expect (space travel, moving forward, going somewhere different, somewhere brand new)...

There are too many layers, too many unknown unknowns for me to go further.

There are known unknowns too of course - what is older!Doctor's plan, who is River, what's up with the Silence etc etc. But they're easy, so far as they go, because we know that they'll be answered. It's the unknown unknowns that will change everything and turn it upside down... Go read the fic and you'll see what I mean:

(There are so many questions she’d like to ask, but she’s afraid the answers will change.)

Comments

[beer-good-foamy.livejournal.com]

("You said you were in the library!"
"So was the swimming pool!")

...Woah.

[elisi]

!

[skipthedemon.livejournal.com]

("You said you were in the library!"
"So was the swimming pool!")

My brain just broke. O.o

[angearia.livejournal.com]

COOL. I'm looking forward to more (when the next episode airs)!

And check me out, I'm reading meta as the series is airing!

[elisi]

COOL. I'm looking forward to more (when the next episode airs)!
Oh I'll try my best. Unless my head actually implodes... ;)

And yay! It is good to have you onboard!

[owlboy]

Ofcourse getting married/having kids in yr 20s is a valid choice...but the issue I had with Amy being pregnant at 22 was that it just doesn't seem like Amy, you know? I mean we've just spent a whole year trying to make her realize marrying Rory is what she really wants! Would she really have kids so soon?

>>No pointless pining - River is a woman of action.

That helps...thanks for pointing that out. I had issues with that speech, but I gotta say, River's expressions [especially when she says 'My Doctor'] just break me.

on visual parallels:

http://disparue.org/gallery/6/doctorwho/5/505/images/doctorwho505_2588.jpg

http://img857.imageshack.us/i/dw6x010695.jpg/

water water waterklglfh cj djdff

[elisi]

I mean we've just spent a whole year trying to make her realize marrying Rory is what she really wants! Would she really have kids so soon?
I am DEEPLY distrustful of pregnancies on TV. Like you say, it might not be the thing that's best for her, but I'll need to know that it's a real baby before I make up my mind further. (Mostly I was grumbling at people who seem to think that this is the wrong choice for *anyone*.)

That helps...thanks for pointing that out. I had issues with that speech, but I gotta say, River's expressions [especially when she says 'My Doctor'] just break me.
My pleasure. And Promethia pointed out that once she is actually there, with Ten, she goes on to distinguish quite sharply between 'her Doctor' (who knows her), and the one in front of her, who isn't hers at all. It's a good coping strategy.

on visual parallels:
Oooooooh. Water. Water water water...

[promethia_tenk]

That helps...thanks for pointing that out. I had issues with that speech, but I gotta say, River's expressions [especially when she says 'My Doctor'] just break me.
I'm a bit :-\ over it too (especially the "young, impressionable girl" thing, as we've discussed), but the conclusion that I've come to is that you have to take it a bit figuratively: it's all raw, emotional core without much tempering by reality or perspective. She's trying to understand the pain of what she's going through, not laying out a comprehensive life philosophy.

Also a bit like Amy's speech about the Doctor and the starwhale: not strictly factually accurate (all that pain and misery and loneliness . . . and it just made it kind), a little hyperbolic and melodramatic, and yet also true.

[zanthinegirl.livejournal.com]

Ooh! Some very interesting points. i hadn't thought of all the water parallels, but that doesn't seem coincidental.

I twigged to "older doctor" fairly early on, but it was still kinda heart breaking.

I'm just anxious to see how they tie things up. This season is looking very interesting already!

[elisi]

Ooh! Some very interesting points. i hadn't thought of all the water parallels, but that doesn't seem coincidental.
I've been drowning in them for the past year... :) (NOTHING IS A COINCIDENCE!)

I twigged to "older doctor" fairly early on, but it was still kinda heart breaking.
It really was.

I'm just anxious to see how they tie things up. This season is looking very interesting already!
It's the new Lost!

[me-llamo-nic.livejournal.com]

I agree with nearly everything here. Good points all around and I like the visual aid (especially the first one).

The one hang-up for me is whether or not it's River who kills The Doctor. The Impossible Astronaut definitely has me wavering on that one though. The thing is, if it's not The Doctor that she killed, then who is this other great person in her life? Although, with the way the death happened (assuming it sticks), it seems impossible that that could be the murder for which she would be (had been) arrested and imprisoned.

I do think that IF the person she's supposed to have killed is The Doctor, then it was undoubtedly part of some plan that they'd cooked up together.

My head's spinning again now that I'm thinking about this. It's too early for this much thinking.

[elisi]

I agree with nearly everything here. Good points all around and I like the visual aid (especially the first one).
My pleasure. :) And I've seen a lot of people wtf? over that first scene, so I thought I'd better point out that the British are also very good at bawdy humour. *g*

My head's spinning again now that I'm thinking about this. It's too early for this much thinking.
My head has been spinning for a long time... (And yes to all your thoughts. I think. Although why would they think up a plan that would land her in prison? *deep breath* We just need to be patient.)

[owlboy]

You could deduce that River kills the Doctor, but that would make sense. Moffat uses special moon logic our tiny Earth minds are not privy to.

The way the man writes... the "very good man" might not be "good" at all. I mean in Press Gang he turns a blatant asshole into a "hero". I wouldn't be surprised if he does that here...

[ladypeyton.livejournal.com]

I'm beginning to wonder if Amy's baby might not be River...

[elisi]

Most of fandom is doing the same I think. But somehow I doubt it. It's... too simple, y'know?

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

I totally, totally agree with you on Amy and Rory. I never thought that I would ship something on this show so hard—until last series, DW was my “I don’t ship anything” series. And now there’s Amy and Rory AND Eleven and River, and I really don’t know what to do with myself. There is so much love. I especially loved how very domestic Amy and Rory were at the beginning, because I have a domesticity kink with my

And I know exactly what you mean about their portrayal being unique. I come from a community where it’s not at all shocking to get married at about 20 and most people tend to get married in their early to mid 20s. I think that thinking of that as too young is a regional/class thing, really, because people get married younger here in the South and also the poorer you are, the more likely you are to get married young. When you know that you’re probably never going to be “financially ready” to “start a family,” there’s really nothing stopping you. When you know you aren’t going to college, what’s the point of waiting? When you’re going to live in your small town forever, holding off can seem kind of pointless. Not saying that it’s always the best decision, because I’ve certainly seen some stupid marriages. But I’ve seen just as many (if not more) really wonderful ones.

ANYWAY. That was so not the point. But I have a lot of ~feelings~ on this issue, clearly. Back to the actual post.

How happy am I to see Mark Sheppard playing a good guy? SO VERY HAPPY. I adore that man, and obviously he’s great at the bad guys, but it’s so fun seeing him play good for once!

The Doctor/River flirting was just OFF THE SCALE! If I had the time I'd list every line they spoke...

It made me so happy! This is the most delightful ship! I really never, ever thought I’d ship the Doctor with someone, and I didn’t like River when she first appeared, but I completely admit I was wrong, because I LOVE them!

Now several things ameliorate this for me - one, when she gets out of prison (for good), she doesn’t sit around wringing her hands. She gets her professorship and finds a little team of her own (Anita, the Daves) and goes off on her own adventures. No pointless pining - River is a woman of action.

I agree, and this is a point that I think has been missed. I’m one of those people who always pays more attention to what characters do than what they say because people lie or people say what they think is the truth but the truth turns out to be more complicated.

OH I LOVE THIS SHOW. SO MUCH DELIGHT EVERYWHERE.

[elisi]

I totally, totally agree with you on Amy and Rory. I never thought that I would ship something on this show so hard—until last series, DW was my “I don’t ship anything” series. And now there’s Amy and Rory AND Eleven and River, and I really don’t know what to do with myself.
STEALTH SHIPS! *g* But I know what you mean... The only ship I had was Doctor/Master, which is of course a sort of anti-ship. And I was inclined to like River, but I didn't ship the Doctor with humans (or mortals, I should say), so clearly I'd never ship them... And then she just HBIC'd across the screen in S5 and TOTALLY won my heart. ♥ Amy/Rory is sort of the counter point - the sweet, [more or less] straight forward love story.

ANYWAY. That was so not the point. But I have a lot of ~feelings~ on this issue, clearly.
Heh. Yeah, I was only going to write a line or two... But it's a fact that I have never in my life been more sure of anything than I was on my wedding day. I can't explain it, but it's true. And for that to be celebrated is just wonderful. (Esp by someone like Moffat who had a pretty disastrous first marriage...) Anyway, we got married and then went off to university together and it was BRILLIANT. :)

How happy am I to see Mark Sheppard playing a good guy? SO VERY HAPPY. I adore that man, and obviously he’s great at the bad guys, but it’s so fun seeing him play good for once!
Also I noticed on subsequent viewings that he... admires the Doctor a great deal. (Smart and handsome! How's a guy supposed to resist?)

It made me so happy! This is the most delightful ship! I really never, ever thought I’d ship the Doctor with someone, and I didn’t like River when she first appeared, but I completely admit I was wrong, because I LOVE them!
See above. :) And oh, they're so fabulous and the Doctor's FACE after the 'I'm quite the screamer!' line... *dies*

I agree, and this is a point that I think has been missed. I’m one of those people who always pays more attention to what characters do than what they say because people lie or people say what they think is the truth but the truth turns out to be more complicated.
*nods a lot* Esp when it's a character like River who is known for lying...

OH I LOVE THIS SHOW. SO MUCH DELIGHT EVERYWHERE.
♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥

[eilowyn.livejournal.com]

Oh, Elisi! I have been waiting for your reaction since the episode aired, and I was not disappointed.

On Amy and Rory: in my social circle it's the norm for a Christian couple to marry and have children young. You get your college degree, get married that summer, and have your first child by 23. Because there are no quibbles about dating - this is the person GOD wants you to marry, so you get married because (supposedly) you won't be having sex until that ring's on her finger, so you go ahead and do it. And I adore Amy and Rory just as they are, a couple of kids madly in love.

ROLLING IN THE DEEP - I didn't know it was that song (or maybe I recognized it but didn't realize the significance) but OH MAN! River and the Doctor are ALL OVER that chorus.

The thing I love most about the Doctor/River is how it's a relationship unfolding - we don't know the details, but we realize how significant they are to each other, and we get to watch how the story unfold before us, told by a master of the craft. I love Joss, but I don't have the quibbles about Moffat-led Doctor Who that I do about Buffy, and I think the fact that they keep it approachable for both adults and children is one of the reasons Doctor Who shines just a bit brighter.

[elisi]

Oh, Elisi! I have been waiting for your reaction since the episode aired, and I was not disappointed.
OH GOOD! (Honestly this is like a FRACTION of my thoughts. A snippet. A taster. But I just can't write it all out, or I'd still be here next week...)

And I adore Amy and Rory just as they are, a couple of kids madly in love.
*nods a lot* The fact that they take that leap - isn't that part of what love is all about? (Yes it can be stupid, but in this case me thinks that 2000 years worth of waiting probably counts as proof enough. *g*)

ROLLING IN THE DEEP - I didn't know it was that song (or maybe I recognized it but didn't realize the significance) but OH MAN! River and the Doctor are ALL OVER that chorus.
I eagerly await the vids...

The thing I love most about the Doctor/River is how it's a relationship unfolding - we don't know the details, but we realize how significant they are to each other, and we get to watch how the story unfold before us, told by a master of the craft.
That's it in a nutshell. Plus the fact that every revelation changes what came before. *is reduced to flailing*

I love Joss, but I don't have the quibbles about Moffat-led Doctor Who that I do about Buffy, and I think the fact that they keep it approachable for both adults and children is one of the reasons Doctor Who shines just a bit brighter.
Very true. And I love the fact that it's something I can share with my children. (Buffy is... not child friendly.)

[cassi0pei4.livejournal.com]

Damn. I totally missed the library/swimming pool line's relationship with the two astronaut locations.

That's flipping awesome. Just. Damn. So many cool things!

Nice catch!

[elisi]

Damn. I totally missed the library/swimming pool line's relationship with the two astronaut locations.
It took me a few days, but when it hit me, I almost died. :D

[independence1776]

The Doctor died, and there were no comedy vultures, no overwrought despair. Just a man, gathering his friends for one last time, and then meeting his final adventure head-on. It was A Good Death

Yes. And that is why, even though it was a huge shock, it doesn't bother me. I want to know why, of course, and it's hard to watch, but it's right. Wonderfully acted, and the scenery couldn't have been more perfect.

Her final end is not that tear-stained goodbye to a man who doesn’t know her yet. It’s a loving confirmation from the man who trusts her completely: Yes, he was always there to catch her.

:D (I have nothing to say aside from that. My opinion about those episodes may be changed yet.)

What is real, what is not? A story only dies if it’s forgotten or lost, and that is her greatest fear... And that is what the Silence represents, the terror underpinning the whole narrative. You look away, you forget. People, stories, erased from the world.

Now this gave me the first reason to find them scary, because I haven't so far. (We'll see come Saturday.) But you laying out why they're supposed to be, now I'm beginning to understand.

[elisi]

Yes. And that is why, even though it was a huge shock, it doesn't bother me. I want to know why, of course, and it's hard to watch, but it's right. Wonderfully acted, and the scenery couldn't have been more perfect.
There is part of me that doesn't want it undone? Because it was so right, and they have 200 years worth of adventures to play with. But of course that would mean that Matt had to stay on forever, and that is (sadly) not possible...

:D (I have nothing to say aside from that. My opinion about those episodes may be changed yet.)
EVERYTHING goes back to the Library episodes. It's ridiculous. (I know River's ending is problematic, but it works so well symbolically that I quite simply can't dislike it literally.)

Now this gave me the first reason to find them scary, because I haven't so far. (We'll see come Saturday.) But you laying out why they're supposed to be, now I'm beginning to understand.
Well they erased the whole universe, so they're a bit unsettling to say the least! *g* (But yeah, scary.)

[aerintine.livejournal.com]

Oh, I am flailing with love! I feel so lucky to get to soak up your gorgeous thoughts as this season unfolds. You are the perfect bearer of all that is good, and I declare you my sole source of truth in DW fandom.

I am so mad for all of these characters. I want to jump up and down and clap and twirl with happiness that I have the privilege of getting to know them.

Your thoughts on River are astounding. I'm just staggered at the symbolism, and the epicness of the love she shares with The Doctor. Really, the twin love stories between Amy/Rory and River/Doctor make my heart explode. Boom.

And people actually gripe about Amy and Rory getting married "too young?" Really. Too young. They're both 2 millenia old, according to their experience with the Pandorica. That's older than The Doctor. Doesn't matter that in the timeline they get hitched they'd forgotten for a little while. It was still inside them, that knowledge that spanned hundreds of lifetimes. These kids are old souls. And frankly, even if they weren't, they're lovely and wonderful together and neither is diminished by marrying with the other. They're more themselves together than apart - that's what marriage is all about!


Seriously, new favorite show. I will cling to its skirts for as long as it will have me.

[elisi]

Oh, I am flailing with love! I feel so lucky to get to soak up your gorgeous thoughts as this season unfolds. You are the perfect bearer of all that is good, and I declare you my sole source of truth in DW fandom.
*preens* (Although you'll have to take promethia_tenk too, since we share a brain. Half of the stuff in this post probably belongs to her. Have you seen my user info?) *loves show to RIDICULOUS lengths*

I am so mad for all of these characters. I want to jump up and down and clap and twirl with happiness that I have the privilege of getting to know them.
Yes, that's it. And I didn't mention it (there's TOO MUCH going on), but they way the group dynamics work is just amazing.

Your thoughts on River are astounding. I'm just staggered at the symbolism, and the epicness of the love she shares with The Doctor. Really, the twin love stories between Amy/Rory and River/Doctor make my heart explode. Boom.
I, uh, might have spent the past year thinking about this (and discussing it with Promethia, trying to uncover all the layers). And then the Moff just keeps bringing MORE and I can't keep up... (I got KathyH to make me this icon, which sums up a lot of my thoughts, actually.)

And people actually gripe about Amy and Rory getting married "too young?" Really. Too young. They're both 2 millenia old, according to their experience with the Pandorica.
LOL!

These kids are old souls. And frankly, even if they weren't, they're lovely and wonderful together and neither is diminished by marrying with the other. They're more themselves together than apart - that's what marriage is all about!
That's the perfect way of putting it, yes. (And I have flailed at length about how wonderful they are together and how much I ADORE the fact that Rory is just Rory, and that this is celebrated. I tell my daughters that when they grow up they should find someone like him!)

Seriously, new favorite show. I will cling to its skirts for as long as it will have me.
You and me both! :)

[scatteredintime.livejournal.com]

("You said you were in the library!"
"So was the swimming pool!")

Well. Did you hear my brain snapping? The simplest things.

One of my friends was rewatching SitL/FotD and the simplest thing obvious? Silence in the Library. The title might just have been a coincidence, nothing planned at all, but ever since Moffat took over? I don't wholly believe in coincidences where he is involved. It may not have been planned in the first place, but would I be surprised if he somehow linked the Silence and the Library? No.

[elisi]

Well. Did you hear my brain snapping? The simplest things.
LOL! :D

Silence in the Library. The title might just have been a coincidence, nothing planned at all, but ever since Moffat took over? I don't wholly believe in coincidences where he is involved.
Welcome to the club. Plus - Library. Stories. We're all stories in the end. Rewriting time/people/their stories. Water is time...

I AM DROWNING IN METAPHORS!

[arwen-elen.livejournal.com]

The music playing at the very, very end when Amy shoots the astronaut/little girl is The Life And Death Of Amy Pond - one of my favourite pieces of music ever.


Totally agree with this :) and the ending was so heart-rending as well, I always cry. Just their horrified faces is enough to set me off *sighs*

[elisi]

Totally agree with this :) and the ending was so heart-rending as well, I always cry. Just their horrified faces is enough to set me off *sighs*
Re-watched it the other night, and knowing who River is... OH MY HEART! (This is what I meant in my previous reply - how the further you go along, the more depth gets added to what came before.)