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Not a review. Just bafflement in the face of inanity.
First of all, then THIS is the best summary of #39 ever. :) (Much gratitude to ![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
shipperx for the link!)
Now I promised myself that I wouldn't write anything, but...
We have been told that the theme of s8 is 'betrayal'. During 'Anywhere But Here' Buffy was shown the final scene of this issue, and when asked what had happened was told: 'Betrayal. The closest, the most unexpected.'
I'm afraid this doesn't make sense to me. Is Buffy feeling that she betrayed herself? Well first of all she didn't know what would happen when she broke the Seed, so that's rather unlikely. Or - presuming that she somehow magically *did* know and that's why she went for the Seed rather than Twangel (that part still makes no sense. Why not kill him? WHY? WHY?) - um, where was I? Oh yes. Presuming she *did* know(*), why would she feel betrayed over destroying magic & losing her powers? She was even asked in 'Anywhere But Here' if that wasn't what she'd always wanted, plus she and all the baby Slayers sat down and let go of all their powers on purpose during Operation Sitting Duck, and seemed perfectly happy. Plus, if she's feeling sorry for herself, then that makes her as shallow as a puddle considering Giles' fate.
Which leads us back to Twangel as the betrayer, which makes her the dumbest thing in the history of the 'verse...
*sigh*
It didn't make sense in the beginning, and it doesn't make sense now. What a surprise.
(*)infinitewhale points out that Giles was trying to destroy the Seed when Twangel killed him, so that's where Buffy gets the idea! \o/
shipperx for the link!)Now I promised myself that I wouldn't write anything, but...
We have been told that the theme of s8 is 'betrayal'. During 'Anywhere But Here' Buffy was shown the final scene of this issue, and when asked what had happened was told: 'Betrayal. The closest, the most unexpected.'
I'm afraid this doesn't make sense to me. Is Buffy feeling that she betrayed herself? Well first of all she didn't know what would happen when she broke the Seed, so that's rather unlikely. Or - presuming that she somehow magically *did* know and that's why she went for the Seed rather than Twangel (that part still makes no sense. Why not kill him? WHY? WHY?) - um, where was I? Oh yes. Presuming she *did* know(*), why would she feel betrayed over destroying magic & losing her powers? She was even asked in 'Anywhere But Here' if that wasn't what she'd always wanted, plus she and all the baby Slayers sat down and let go of all their powers on purpose during Operation Sitting Duck, and seemed perfectly happy. Plus, if she's feeling sorry for herself, then that makes her as shallow as a puddle considering Giles' fate.
Which leads us back to Twangel as the betrayer, which makes her the dumbest thing in the history of the 'verse...
*sigh*
It didn't make sense in the beginning, and it doesn't make sense now. What a surprise.
(*)
infinitewhale points out that Giles was trying to destroy the Seed when Twangel killed him, so that's where Buffy gets the idea! \o/
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Not mixy things.
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Snake Lady said there'd be remnants of magic, but very little. Warren croaks because it was Amy's ongoing magic that kept him alive. Almost, if not all, Earth magic is gone.
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Indeed.
*deep, deep, deep sigh*
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LOOK AT THE MONKEY! LOOK AT THE MONKEY!
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She breaks that Seed because that's what Giles was going to do before Twangel killed him.
As for the betrayal itself, I think it's still a mystery as to what it was. I don't think it was Giles or breaking the Seed ending the Slayer line (since she doesn't even know that yet). I've got a theory! But it's just that.
A bigger question is why Giles's body, Xander and Angel aren't in that panel in issue 10.
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Hey, you're right! Thank you. :)
As for the betrayal itself, I think it's still a mystery as to what it was. I don't think it was Giles or breaking the Seed ending the Slayer line (since she doesn't even know that yet). I've got a theory! But it's just that.
Yeah. It'd make sense without all the 'betrayal' stuff, but since that's the *theme*... No, I've got nothin'.
A bigger question is why Giles's body, Xander and Angel aren't in that panel in issue 10.
Spoilers! :)
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And Joss doens't do that.
He does Gotchas.
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Also helps if you're not immediately expected to forget the gotcha right after. Or the gotcha having no sense whatsoever.
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Silly reader. You want logic and cause and effect and things that make sense. [/snark]
Honestly, my opinion isn't far off from the snark. The "she's betraying herself" theme is basically "we're going to write Buffy doing stupid stuff for several years".
The betrayal isn't breaking the seed. It's her having been OOC in the worst possible way from day one (and it was day one. When going back for research for the nertz-ficathon, I re-read the beginning and Buffy was quite appalling in Issue 1 where she was cutting down Dawn behind her back and completely unconcerned with what had befallen Dawn.)
Buffy has betrayed everything "Buffy". She betrayed her sister by not bothering to give much of a damn about whatever Dawn was going through. She 'betrayed' her morals by robbing banks. She 'betrayed' her position of authority by sleeping with a subordinate who was in love with her but who she didn't love back, just to make herself feel better and just to scratch a sexual itch. She 'betrayed' her responsibility to the Slayers that she called by facing off with the guy who had plotted against them but as soon as it was revealed to be her ex-boyfriend she abandoned them to their fates while she jumped Angel's bones. Had it been anyone else that had been Twilight and had gotten them to that point, she would not have have dismissed all that had gone before so very, very easily. She betrayed her moral center when she could look at a dying world -- dying because of her own space-boink -- and still define it as "best day ever." She betrayed Spike by cutting him down to Angel behind his back and by reducing his death to "studly". All of her compromises and blind eyes toward Angel and easy excuses for rationalization and self-satisfaction has resulted in a catastrophe and resulted in the death of Giles. Her destroying the seed was the end of it. It's not the betrayal itself but the period at the end of the sentence. Giles death pretty much makes it impossible for her to lie to herself any more and thus the seed of wonder has to die.
Now, it's shit writing because they have never made a point of this, that what she's done isn't okay. She and everyone in the comic (and in forums) rationalize her behavior, and by their giving glow-juice, and "the universe made me do it" and it's really Twilight that's the cause, the writers have forced her choices then blame her for the choices she's forced to make. That's hardly fair. That doesn't even make sense, but Joss loves to have characters do bad things that are only 'kinda-sorta' their fault.
The primary problem we've had all along is we have no idea of why Buffy did any of this. Why did she rob banks? It wasn't really necessary. Why would she not kill Angel now when she would have back during the show (and given all the ways she's not held Angel responsible for anything in this comic, I can't say that Giles was disloyal in thinking that she wouldn't. It really didn't matter what Angel did, she turned a blind eye).
The closest and most unexpected betrayal was Buffy betraying everything she stood for or believed in. Why it's really horrible writing is that even after all of that, we have no idea why or to what purpose, which leaves us at Buffy did it because Joss and Dark Horse say she did.
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That's not snark, that's just basic powers of observation.
The betrayal isn't breaking the seed. It's her having been OOC in the worst possible way from day one (and it was day one. When going back for research for the nertz-ficathon, I re-read the beginning and Buffy was quite appalling in Issue 1 where she was cutting down Dawn behind her back and completely unconcerned with what had befallen Dawn.)
You know, I remember reading issue 1 (review here, and there was one panel that was just *my* Buffy. Sadly I never saw her again. *sigh*
The closest and most unexpected betrayal was Buffy betraying everything she stood for or believed in. Why it's really horrible writing is that even after all of that, we have no idea why or to what purpose, which leaves us at Buffy did it because Joss and Dark Horse say she did.
Amen. Although we still don't know if they think the bakrobbing/helicopters/castle was a betrayal or not. (I think it was wildly OOC, but I don't know if they do...)
*deep sigh*
Your comment does a very good job of summing up all the problems. Thank you.
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She and everyone in the comic (and in forums) rationalize her behavior...
Especially that right there, which...I don't get. At all. That's beyond a blind eye.
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Buffy actually betrayed all things Buffy. And if the story was told decently that might even be an interesting idea.
Only it isn't. It makes no sense whatsoever why she would act so dumb and OOC all of the sudden. And even less why she would realise that betrayal in that moment. Because as you said if Giles dies and all she think "OMG, I've forsaken my ideals" then she is shallow as puddle.
I think a million years ago Joss had a few very vague interesting ideas for that comic. Then he got completely bored and distracted and this is what came out. He even says himself it's not really Buffy.
I wonder how he'll talk about the comics when no one's job is depending any more.
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*nods* The thing is, I'm *good* at meta. I know this. Yet I try to apply all my normal methods to this mess and come out more confused. :(
I think a million years ago Joss had a few very vague interesting ideas for that comic. Then he got completely bored and distracted and this is what came out. He even says himself it's not really Buffy.
And now I'm nostalgic for the Bot...
I wonder how he'll talk about the comics when no one's job is depending any more.
*snerk* Indeed.
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I came to that thought when it became clear that Warren was running around without his skin, despite the fact that the first evil was able to impersonate him...
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LOL! That might be the best explanation I've ever read! :)
I came to that thought when it became clear that Warren was running around without his skin, despite the fact that the first evil was able to impersonate him...
Oh but one's easy to explain - Joss admitted to forgetting about The First wearing his face!
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O_o
to
O_o
to my repeated "I'm NOT making this up!"
It was very amusing.
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I suppose that makes sense that Giles was trying to break the seed and not kill Twangel, but it was still a dumbass move, and Giles is smarter/better than that. Our Giles would have flung the damn thing at the Seed instead of even getting close to that fight.
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I had to fight SO HARD not to add 'What's your excuse?'... *g* (But I *was* paid, and that'll never get old.)
I suppose that makes sense that Giles was trying to break the seed and not kill Twangel,
Especially because he *frames* it in 'Buffy wouldn't kill Twangel' terms. I didn't realise that he was going for the Seed until it was pointed out to me... *deep sigh*
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As for Giles, I could see that being the case, but I'm still unsure if that was actually the case.
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As for Giles, I could see that being the case, but I'm still unsure if that was actually the case.
Well, no answer will ever be forthcoming. It's like 'choose your own adventure', except different. Maybe 'choose your own motivation'.
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As for the "choose your own adventure" thing, considering that the comics are just...anyway, I'd say that he was trying to kill Twangel on his lonesome in that sense :p I mean, it would have made more sense if that had been Xander attempting to enter the fray to save Buffy--not Giles. Pfft.
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That makes perfect sense to me. :)
As for the rest, then 'sense' doesn't really come into it...
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I think Allie actually said he was going to break it. The only reason I thought it was because he seems to be running *away* from Angel in the panel and toward the Seed.
Still waiting for someone to clear up why Amy is weepy at Warren dying when she was planning to kill him herself in issue 35.
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