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Lie To Me.
We watched 'Lie To Me' and 'The Dark Age' Saturday night and I've been jotting down thoughts at odd moments. I thought I'd do both together, but since I've finished 'Lie To Me' I figured I might as well post it now, because I doubt I'll have time to write anything else today. Why oh why can't I just shut off my brain? Anyway, I hope you enjoy - S2 is *such* a wonderful Season!
Lie To Me
This is a brilliant episode and one I doubt I'll ever tire of. The theme is straight out of 'House': "Everybody Lies!"
Although of course there is an exception: Buffy and Spike! I don’t want to delve too much into that, but just steer you in the direction of Spring Summers’ fabulous review.
But - onto my own thoughts. First of all, just to get it out of the way:
Spike as Master Vampire w. minions is *so* cool! Mostly I could just go *guh*! Mmmmm, Evil!Spike...
There are minor points of interst, such as Buffy using Ford to make Angel jealous (this time more justified than with Xander, since Angel is obviously lying to her).
Also Angel thinks like an investigator (trying to find out Ford’s history), which is a nice little piece of foreshadowing.
Now for the meat of the episode. There is so much there, that I feel like I’m hardly scratching the surface, sadly.
Ford is an interesting character - someone who knows he’s going to die and seeks a way out. And if he happens to be causing lots of innocents’ death, then so be it - he doesn’t deserve to die. Buffy of course is not having any of it:
”You have a choice. You don't have a good choice, but you have a choice! You're opting for mass murder here, and nothing you say is gonna make that okay!”
Now this all made me think of Cassie of S7’s ‘Help’. Her circumstances are of course different, but she was someone making the other choice. She was fatalistic (and depressed, understandably) but she kept helping people right up till the end.
Another point of course is Ford’s tendency to tell stories (much like Andrew later on, showing how immature he really is). His scene with Spike where he insists on going by traditions is very good at showing us this:
Ford: That doesn't matter. I've got something to offer you. I-I'm pretty sure this is the part where you take out a watch and say I've got thirty seconds to convince you not to kill me? (smiles) It's traditional.
He really is just a little boy, telling himself friendly stories about vampires...
ETA: I like this conversation between Angel and Chantarelle:
Chantarelle: "So many people have that misconception. But they who walk with the night are not interested in harming anyone. They are creatures above us. Exalted!"
Angel: "You're a fool."
Chantarelle: "You don't have to be so confrontational about it. Other viewpoints than yours may be valid, you know."
The word that stuck out for me was 'viewpoint'. Chantarelle doesn't have a 'viewpoint' - she believes a lie. A viewpoint depends on the thing in question being open to interpretation: F.ex. some people love Spike, whereas others violently dislike him - those are viewpoints, opinions. But when we come to a matter of say history or physics you are dealing with facts. True and false. It is important to distinguish between these things!
~
I noticed something about Willow. It was partly the hilarious scene where she’s babbling madly, trying to keep the secret that she and Angel looked up info on Ford (her laugh is fabulous - the scene promted Darcy to say that he thinks that AH is (at this point) probably the best - or most subtle - actor on the show). Anyway - she’s hopeless at lying. If asked she’d probably say that she is incredibly honest. And yet... from the very first episode she has quite happily hacked into any files that the gang need - the school, the council, anywhere they need information she’ll extract confidential stuff without even a flicker of worry.
I find this very interesting. I think she sees 'the computer stuff' as a way of using her talents - and later she will view magic the same way. It somehow slips under her moral radar completely.
But - the stars of the show is the triangle of Buffy, Angel and Drusilla. Watching the scene at the beginning is a delight, knowing all of the history between Angel and Dru, even as it is incredibly creepy.
Drusilla: “Do you remember the song mummy used to sing me? Pretty.”
Angel: “I remember.”
Drusilla: “Yes, you do.”
I would love to delve into the Dru/Angel(us) stuff, but I really don’t have time and also it has been done before. Instead I’ll just rec two (outstanding) vids:
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dualbunny’s Spanish Doll (about Dru - tragic and beautiful.)
Andspikeylover’s Ghost of a Rose. (Spike/Dru, Fanged Four. Stunning and haunting.)
But back to the ep. - yet again we have an example of Angel going over Buffy’s head - he tells Dru to get out of town. Until Buffy confronts him with what she knows he does not tell her that there is a very powerful and insane vampire in town. This is of course understandable:
Angel: “Sometimes the truth is worse. You live long enough, you find that out.”
Now they have this very interesting conversation, and - as has been noticed by many - before Angel tells Buffy about Dru, he asks her a question:
Angel: “Do you love me?”
It’s only a couple of episodes since they first went out for coffe, although they’ve known each other for about a year. Why does he do it? Does he want to know where they stand? Is he just being manipulative? Is he desperate to get some sort of confirmation from her, before he tears himself down? Whatever the case, her answer is very telling, as is his reply:
Buffy: “I love you. I don't know if I trust you.”
Angel: “Maybe you shouldn't do either.”
I know I’ve said this before, but from then on, love and trust will always be intertwined in her mind. From ‘Seeing Red’:
Buffy: “I have feelings for you. I do. But I could never trust you enough for it to be love.”
After Angel she doesn’t give her heart away anymore - she has learnt the hard way. Of course Spike does earn her trust, but it takes a very, very long time...
But - Angel tells Buffy about Drusilla. Note how he always uses ‘I’ and ‘me’ when speaking of what Angelus did. Anyway, this is a giant huge flashing neon sign: 'Do not date this guy!!!! Seriously!!'
Of course Buffy doesn’t heed the warnings - she is young and still, to a large extent, foolish. As she says to Giles at the end:
Buffy: “Nothing's ever simple anymore. I'm constantly trying to work it out. Who to love or hate. Who to trust. It's just, like, the more I know, the more confused I get.”
Giles: “I believe that's called growing up.”
And it is then very fitting that this is the theme of the next episode.
Lie To Me
This is a brilliant episode and one I doubt I'll ever tire of. The theme is straight out of 'House': "Everybody Lies!"
Although of course there is an exception: Buffy and Spike! I don’t want to delve too much into that, but just steer you in the direction of Spring Summers’ fabulous review.
But - onto my own thoughts. First of all, just to get it out of the way:
Spike as Master Vampire w. minions is *so* cool! Mostly I could just go *guh*! Mmmmm, Evil!Spike...
There are minor points of interst, such as Buffy using Ford to make Angel jealous (this time more justified than with Xander, since Angel is obviously lying to her).
Also Angel thinks like an investigator (trying to find out Ford’s history), which is a nice little piece of foreshadowing.
Now for the meat of the episode. There is so much there, that I feel like I’m hardly scratching the surface, sadly.
Ford is an interesting character - someone who knows he’s going to die and seeks a way out. And if he happens to be causing lots of innocents’ death, then so be it - he doesn’t deserve to die. Buffy of course is not having any of it:
”You have a choice. You don't have a good choice, but you have a choice! You're opting for mass murder here, and nothing you say is gonna make that okay!”
Now this all made me think of Cassie of S7’s ‘Help’. Her circumstances are of course different, but she was someone making the other choice. She was fatalistic (and depressed, understandably) but she kept helping people right up till the end.
Another point of course is Ford’s tendency to tell stories (much like Andrew later on, showing how immature he really is). His scene with Spike where he insists on going by traditions is very good at showing us this:
Ford: That doesn't matter. I've got something to offer you. I-I'm pretty sure this is the part where you take out a watch and say I've got thirty seconds to convince you not to kill me? (smiles) It's traditional.
He really is just a little boy, telling himself friendly stories about vampires...
ETA: I like this conversation between Angel and Chantarelle:
Chantarelle: "So many people have that misconception. But they who walk with the night are not interested in harming anyone. They are creatures above us. Exalted!"
Angel: "You're a fool."
Chantarelle: "You don't have to be so confrontational about it. Other viewpoints than yours may be valid, you know."
The word that stuck out for me was 'viewpoint'. Chantarelle doesn't have a 'viewpoint' - she believes a lie. A viewpoint depends on the thing in question being open to interpretation: F.ex. some people love Spike, whereas others violently dislike him - those are viewpoints, opinions. But when we come to a matter of say history or physics you are dealing with facts. True and false. It is important to distinguish between these things!
~
I noticed something about Willow. It was partly the hilarious scene where she’s babbling madly, trying to keep the secret that she and Angel looked up info on Ford (her laugh is fabulous - the scene promted Darcy to say that he thinks that AH is (at this point) probably the best - or most subtle - actor on the show). Anyway - she’s hopeless at lying. If asked she’d probably say that she is incredibly honest. And yet... from the very first episode she has quite happily hacked into any files that the gang need - the school, the council, anywhere they need information she’ll extract confidential stuff without even a flicker of worry.
I find this very interesting. I think she sees 'the computer stuff' as a way of using her talents - and later she will view magic the same way. It somehow slips under her moral radar completely.
But - the stars of the show is the triangle of Buffy, Angel and Drusilla. Watching the scene at the beginning is a delight, knowing all of the history between Angel and Dru, even as it is incredibly creepy.
Drusilla: “Do you remember the song mummy used to sing me? Pretty.”
Angel: “I remember.”
Drusilla: “Yes, you do.”
I would love to delve into the Dru/Angel(us) stuff, but I really don’t have time and also it has been done before. Instead I’ll just rec two (outstanding) vids:
dualbunny’s Spanish Doll (about Dru - tragic and beautiful.)And
spikeylover’s Ghost of a Rose. (Spike/Dru, Fanged Four. Stunning and haunting.)But back to the ep. - yet again we have an example of Angel going over Buffy’s head - he tells Dru to get out of town. Until Buffy confronts him with what she knows he does not tell her that there is a very powerful and insane vampire in town. This is of course understandable:
Angel: “Sometimes the truth is worse. You live long enough, you find that out.”
Now they have this very interesting conversation, and - as has been noticed by many - before Angel tells Buffy about Dru, he asks her a question:
Angel: “Do you love me?”
It’s only a couple of episodes since they first went out for coffe, although they’ve known each other for about a year. Why does he do it? Does he want to know where they stand? Is he just being manipulative? Is he desperate to get some sort of confirmation from her, before he tears himself down? Whatever the case, her answer is very telling, as is his reply:
Buffy: “I love you. I don't know if I trust you.”
Angel: “Maybe you shouldn't do either.”
I know I’ve said this before, but from then on, love and trust will always be intertwined in her mind. From ‘Seeing Red’:
Buffy: “I have feelings for you. I do. But I could never trust you enough for it to be love.”
After Angel she doesn’t give her heart away anymore - she has learnt the hard way. Of course Spike does earn her trust, but it takes a very, very long time...
But - Angel tells Buffy about Drusilla. Note how he always uses ‘I’ and ‘me’ when speaking of what Angelus did. Anyway, this is a giant huge flashing neon sign: 'Do not date this guy!!!! Seriously!!'
Of course Buffy doesn’t heed the warnings - she is young and still, to a large extent, foolish. As she says to Giles at the end:
Buffy: “Nothing's ever simple anymore. I'm constantly trying to work it out. Who to love or hate. Who to trust. It's just, like, the more I know, the more confused I get.”
Giles: “I believe that's called growing up.”
And it is then very fitting that this is the theme of the next episode.
no subject
Buffy: “I love you. I don't know if I trust you.”
Angel: “Maybe you shouldn't do either.”
I know I’ve said this before, but from then on, love and trust will always be intertwined in her mind...
After Angel she doesn’t give her heart away anymore - she has learnt the hard way. Of course Spike does earn her trust, but it takes a very, very long time...
But - Angel tells Buffy about Drusilla. Note how he always uses ‘I’ and ‘me’ when speaking of what Angelus did. Anyway, this is a giant huge flashing neon sign: 'Do not date this guy!!!! Seriously!!'
Of course Buffy doesn’t heed the warnings - she is young and still, to a large extent, foolish
I know we always talk about Spike as being the "fool for love" but really Buffy is just as much of a fool. She doesn't heed the warning signs, she doesn't listen to the advice of others and the results scar her permanently. I suspect that even after Spike there's still a tiny part of her that's permanently frozen over Angel.
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Oh absolutely. The fact that after Angel she keeps trying is (to me anyway) a sign that she's able to get over him in time. She is so very young still, but considering what she overcomes during the course ofthe series I think she'll be just fine! :) Btw you did read
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The Buffy-Angel conversation is the ultimate sign of the totally doomed and unsuitable pairing. But last episode we saw that Angel relates better to Cordy and here we see that Angel even relates better to Willow than to Buffy.
This, of course, is the Something Blue of Willow/Angel 'shippers.
What a beautiful look at Drusilla. "What will your mummy sing when she finds your body?"
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Especially lovely of course in the Spike & Angel scene at the end of 'Damage'. *sigh* The monster/victim above all others is of course Drusilla. I don't know whether you like vids or not, but you really should download the two I linked to. They make me fall in love with Dru all over again.
This, of course, is the Something Blue of Willow/Angel 'shippers.
"Ours is a forbidden love!" Heh.
the totally doomed and unsuitable pairing
I know! I can't remember who it was, but it was someone writing about AtS and noting that Angel really, really, really wasn't a suitable 'boyfriend' for a 16-year-old! Never mind all the Angelus stuff.
Actually since I'm rec'ing vids anyway, I feel I should point you in the direction of I Remember by Rowena. A look at the Buffy/Angel(us) relationship, it's very, very good - I can't say too much because I don't want to spoil you, but it's absolutely worth watching!
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Wow, that's very insightful!! I love all your thoughts, really, but this stuck out at me. What Willow categorizes as "helping" is never wrong in her mind. If she and Tara are fighting, she thinks she should fix the situation by doing a mind wipe. It would have been nice to see this explored a little bite more in Season 7. She certainly felt guilt for becoming Dark!Willow, but I'm not sure she ever discovered exactly what lines shouldn't be crossed while problem-solving.
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I might even end up writing fic... [Eeeek! Scary thought!]
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Hm, wonderful thought! :) And once I finish my WIPs I'll see what I can do...
::blushes::
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I especially like the bit about viewpoint - although history is not necessarily about facts, because we always take the point of view of the winner. Which, in a way, BtVS is from the POV of Buffy ;)
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And I get your point about history - I was just reaching for an example of 'truth versus falsehood' as opposed to a difference of opinion.
And yes, BtVS is absolutely from the point of Buffy - although I think a great percentage adopted Spike's POV in the later seasons...