Well would you look at that...

[elisi]

So glad I adopted this tag many years ago.

My truth. #IStandWithRayFisher pic.twitter.com/eNjYcJ6zwP

— charisma carpenter (@AllCharisma) February 10, 2021

pic.twitter.com/Fw0SkHU87c

— charisma carpenter (@AllCharisma) February 10, 2021

Buffy was a toxic environment and it starts at the top. @AllCharisma is speaking truth and I support her 100%. There was a lot of damage done during that time and many of us are still processing it twenty plus years later. #IStandWithRayFisher #IStandWithCharismaCarpenter https://t.co/WJAmDGm76C

— Amber Benson (@amber_benson) February 10, 2021

Charisma Carpenter is one of the bravest people I know.

I am forever grateful for her courage and for her lending her voice to the Justice League investigation.

Read her truth.

Share her truth.

Protect her at all costs.

“It is time.”

A>E#IStandWithCharisma https://t.co/XcT8OnAfbV

— Ray Fisher (@ray8fisher) February 10, 2021

Variety: Ray Fisher Accuses Joss Whedon of ‘Abusive, Unprofessional’ Behavior on ‘Justice League’ Set

And of course we all remember this:

Joss Whedon Is a ‘Hypocrite Preaching Feminist Ideals,’ Ex-Wife Kai Cole Says (Guest Blog)
“He used his relationship with me as a shield … so no one would question his relationships with other women or scrutinize his writing as anything other than feminist,” she writes

Plus a very angry article here:

20 Years Later, and the Women of Angel Still Deserve More
The deaths of Darla, Fred, and Cordelia Chase were a waste

ETA2:

View this post on Instagram

A post shared by Sarah Michelle (sarahmgellar)

Michelle Trachtenberg: “We win. By surviving.” pic.twitter.com/znJaRIsmVt

— Shannon O'Connor (@ShannonOConnor0) February 10, 2021

On Instagram here: https://www.instagram.com/p/CLH9ce-ByTV/



ETA: I still love my shows. They were more than one man and most of the people who contributed are great - possibly greater than we knew, since the man in question was a hindrance and a menace. :( (See the s8 comics as to how he fared without them!)

ETA2:

It feels right that the female cast of Buffy the Vampire Slayer have banded together to defeat the Big Bad.

— Juno Dawson (@junodawson) February 10, 2021

ETA3: ‘Buffy’ stars weigh in on Charisma Carpenter’s Joss Whedon allegations
I've collated all the responses from Buffy/Angel castmembers re: the Joss Whedon allegations.

Tweet here with more stuff in the thread.

Comments

[ruuger]

Well now, this'll be interesting... Charisma's message is long overdue, but I'm surprised by Amber also coming out against Joss. I wonder if this'll finally open the floodgates and the truth of everything that was going on will come public.

[elisi]

Yeah, Amber took me by surprise. Here's to hoping!

[kerk_hiraeth]

Just as with people like Marion Zimmer Bradley who's Darkover books, and whose editing of what were Darkover fanfiction anthologies; as well as the Sword & Sorcery fantasy anthologies launched the careers of many authors, and ultimately led me to write my own stories and helped shape the person I am ~ and was revealed by her daughter to be as much a paedophile as her husband.

Just as with my parents, and just as with JK Rowling, who, I said of to a hige; distressed fan, that they shouldn't let the evil they do take away the good they did for you and to keep on enjoying the books and the characters that mean so much to you.

I will not let his evil take away what the characters he created gave me and still give me. I will continue to play in his sandbox; even though he will forever be personally banished from my part of it.

kerk

[elisi]

I will not let his evil take away what the characters he created gave me and still give me. I will continue to play in his sandbox; even though he will forever be personally banished from my part of it.
This. The shows will always have a place in my heart, and their brilliance will always be important to me. And they were so much more than just Joss. Where would he be without his writers and actors and directors etc etc.

Here's to banishment!

[deird1]

Interesting. Not surprising, really, but certainly interesting.

[elisi]

I feel this could snowball... OTOH Hollywood's ability to forgive straight white men is basically unparalleled.

[lynnenne]

I’ve always thought Marti Noxon was the real brains behind Buffy, and she got nothing but shit for it. Ditto Tim Minear on Angel.

[elisi]

I’ve always thought Marti Noxon was the real brains behind Buffy, and she got nothing but shit for it.
Mmmm, she was just someone who took the rap for anything that went wrong. >:(

Ditto Tim Minear on Angel.
*nods* Joss was surrounded by a LOT of talent. Let's hope people finally see him for who he is.

[jerusha]

The floodgates seem to have opened. May the truth be revealed.

[elisi]

Hear hear!

[shadowkat]

Meanwhile I got distracted defending MT on Instragram from idiots. "Why now?" Because she was a kid at the time and terrified, hello?, "Why didn't you inform on him, isn't that what you are supposed to do?" Because she had no power, and she'd have been blackballed.

God.

I realized while I was defending her - that I had escaped to Buffy and obsessed over it because I was being serial bullied, gaslit, and in a toxic work situation at the same time. I have a law background. I looked into doing something - and realized I couldn't. I've had it happen in every workplace I've been in - except for possibly one - where I was protected by a female boss, who'd been similarly bullied. (Female boss also was a Trump Supporter...but that's another issue). You can't complain about it - and you can't prove it. There's nothing you can do, except leave, and even that is problematic - because no job.

I got obsessed with Buffy and Angel and the got into the fandom because this was happening to me at that time - and I escaped only to deal with twenty-three months of soul-crushing unemployment. Buffy fandom kind of saved me.

So I find it ironic that the thing that saved me, also had a toxic work environment.

[elisi]

Meanwhile I got distracted defending MT on Instragram from idiots.
Thank you. It's a thankless job, but hopefully you'll have at least helped some of them to a better understanding.

I realized while I was defending her - that I had escaped to Buffy and obsessed over it because I was being serial bullied, gaslit, and in a toxic work situation at the same time.
God, that sucks. :(

You can't complain about it - and you can't prove it. There's nothing you can do, except leave, and even that is problematic - because no job.
This. And I think those who say 'Well just report it' are generally under the privileged impression that the system will work 'like it's supposed to' instead of the reality which is that it is weighted towards those in power.

(Female boss also was a Trump Supporter...but that's another issue).
Life is never simple...

I got obsessed with Buffy and Angel and the got into the fandom because this was happening to me at that time - and I escaped only to deal with twenty-three months of soul-crushing unemployment. Buffy fandom kind of saved me.
♥ I don't know if you're familiar with girlpire but she credits Angel with saving her life. TV can be very powerful.

So I find it ironic that the thing that saved me, also had a toxic work environment.
*nods*

[lirazel]

I still love my shows. They were more than one man and most of the people who contributed are great - possibly greater than we knew, since the man in question was a hindrance and a menace

Yes.

It breaks my heart, but I'm still so thankful for my show.

[elisi]

It breaks my heart, but I'm still so thankful for my show.
Same here. <3

[avrelia]

What I find surprising - how unsurprised I am. we've all heard the rumors, or the people were talking honestly at conventions how unhappy they were...

I am really upset on MT's behalf though...

[elisi]

What I find surprising - how unsurprised I am. we've all heard the rumors, or the people were talking honestly at conventions how unhappy they were...
Same. There have been so many things said over the years, it's almost a relief that someone's finally let the cat out of the bag for good.

I am really upset on MT's behalf though...
Yeah, that one is the worst. And was surprising, in the worst possible way.

[owlboy]

I remember years and years ago SMG talking about how miserable working on the set was but in a ''but that's showbusiness haha!'' kind of way. I was like honey :/

I'm glad people are finally calling out what a vicious prick he is

[elisi]

I remember years and years ago SMG talking about how miserable working on the set was but in a ''but that's showbusiness haha!'' kind of way. I was like honey :/
:( So many clues over the years.

I'm glad people are finally calling out what a vicious prick he is
Me too. He was the Big Bad all along, as that tweet said...

[ever_neutral]

Thanks for collating all of the above, none of which is surprising in the least /o\

I still love my shows. They were more than one man and most of the people who contributed are great - possibly greater than we knew, since the man in question was a hindrance and a menace.

Word.

[elisi]

Thanks for collating all of the above, none of which is surprising in the least /o\
You're welcome. As you say, not surprising...

[a_phoenixdragon]

I am so upset that this man was and is - so damned problematic. I hate that the things we love are ruined by some of the asshats who make them possible. I still love the man's shows. The man himself? Not so much. Makes me sad and angry that he has turned out to be such a nasty dick.

*HUGS*

[elisi]

I hate that the things we love are ruined by some of the asshats who make them possible. I still love the man's shows. The man himself? Not so much. Makes me sad and angry that he has turned out to be such a nasty dick.
It's like... we all knew that he was problematic, but the sheer scale of it is horrible. :(

(As someone said - probably on Twitter - regarding another asshat at some point: Can we just cancel men until we find out what's going on?)

*HUGS BACK*

[sea_thoughts]

I've known for a long time that Charisma was treated terribly on Angel, I wasn't aware of Joss's passive-aggressive threats etc. from the Buffy days but it doesn't surprise me. I linked a reporter from NPR to a clip from DragonCon 2009 where she talks about what happened on set and even there, she's so careful and reiterates how she would work with him again... I'm moved that Charisma finally feels safe enough to speak out about what she went through with no caveats and I hope this helps her.

[elisi]

Yeah, none of this is surprising, but as you say - it's good that she finally feels that she can come forwards.

And that kind of work environment... :( I remember reading an interview with
Emilia Clarke who literally had brain surgery in the early days of playing Daenerys and didn't tell anyone how poorly she was for fear of losing the part.

[gillo]

It's all rather depressing. I'm not surprised about Charisma; it's been known for a very long time that he was less than decent to her when she was on AtS, but Amber did surprise and sadden me. I hate to think she was bullied, I mean, or that the set as a whole was "toxic".

I still love my show. Whedon may be a sh1t, but he had talent and impressive team-building skills. Which in no way justify his conduct.

[elisi]

I hate to think she was bullied, I mean, or that the set as a whole was "toxic".
*nods* Hope they are all OK now.

I still love my show. Whedon may be a sh1t, but he had talent and impressive team-building skills. Which in no way justify his conduct.
Indeed. It succeeded despite him, not because.

(See updates from SMG & MT)

[ragnarok-08.livejournal.com]

All of this really is sobering...

[elisi]

Yeah. Not surprising. But sad that it was even worse than we heard on the grapevine...

[flake-sake.livejournal.com]

yeah, we knew for a while now and of course it goes lower and lower. I'm glad they feel they can speak out now and I hope it will be him who suffers consequences for once.

[elisi]

This. It shouldn't take 20 years for people to be able to speak up, but. Let's hope something changes.

[kathyh]

It is sad but not surprising, particularly about poor Charisma. I just hope that people in the industry now cannot get away with that kind of behaviour any longer.

[elisi]

It is sad but not surprising, particularly about poor Charisma.
Yup, we've all heard the stories. Glad that she finally felt able to speak out properly.

I just hope that people in the industry now cannot get away with that kind of behaviour any longer.
God, let's hope so!

[cynthia2015.livejournal.com]

I've heard Charisma Carpenter address the conflict that occurred behind the scenes. I should have known it was more complicated than that. It's so disheartening to hear but I admire the statements that each costar gave out in support of one another.

[elisi]

I've heard Charisma Carpenter address the conflict that occurred behind the scenes.
Yeah, I think we've all heard about the issues around her pregnancy... :(

I should have known it was more complicated than that.
Well his wife spoke out some years ago and there was the Wonder Woman script (not to mention the s8 comics *shudder*), so it's not surprising. I just wish it wasn't always worse than we thought.

It's so disheartening to hear but I admire the statements that each costar gave out in support of one another.
Yes, the women are all wonderfully supportive of each other, which is the silver lining.

[kazzy-cee.livejournal.com]

Has anyone from Firefly spoken out (so out of fandom!). I would have thought this kind of behaviour was also on that set? I wonder if someone will say something now ....

[elisi]

Has anyone from Firefly spoken out (so out of fandom!).
Not as far as I have seen...

I would have thought this kind of behaviour was also on that set? I wonder if someone will say something now ....
Yeah, you would think it'd carry over. Although the Firefly actors were all older. ASH was shocked, so IDK. :(