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Yay!
Thanks to the wonderfully generous ![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
the_royal_anna, I was able to watch
the_royal_anna, I was able to watch The Girl in the Fireplace.
And oh what fun it was! :) I absolutely loved it - although my most prominent thought (once I started to think it through afterwards) was 'The Doctor got laid! Yay! (Not a single quack from me - not at all! If this sounds bizarre see this post! Hee.) I utterly adored Madame Pompadour and found the story fascinating... it's funny that I'm such a moral person in RL, but such a complete whore when it comes to TV shows. *g*
Now let me try to get my thoughts into something coherent. Yes I (obviously) ship Rose and the Doctor, but it's one of those impossible ships, as was pointed out very well in the previous episode. He has had other companions before her, and will probably have others after. The fact that he had another one alongside, is not likely to diminish or tarnish his feelings in any way (even though Rose is special!). As he said - he thought the queen and the mistress got on very well! (And he gets along with Mickey, so...) Anyway, although the Doctor/Rose relationship has a lot of UST, then (so far at least) that's all it is. And The Doctor is very much taking the slow road with Rose, partly because she is so very young.
Now Madame de Pompadour is different - I loved the fact that her entire life flashed by in what was only a day for The Doctor, since that is how it must feel for him all the time. Asthe_royal_anna put it (in this post):
This is the Doctor: caught between two worlds. Moved to love in time but compelled to live out of time.
He knows that one day he'll have to watch Rose's funeral, just like everyone else - so I cannot blame him for grasping any opportunity when it comes along. Like so many men pouring out their hearts to barmaids, sometimes 'a stranger' is what's needed. I've tried and tried to think of anything within the Jossverse that has the same kind of situation, but the nearest is possibly the B/A kiss in Chosen - the pure escapist bliss that was never suppossed to be known to anyone. Or... it's a bit of a stretch, but Wes/Lilah, where his heart belongs to Fred, but still there is definitely a connection with Lilah. Or to borrow words fromharmonyfb:
No wonder the Doctor found Madame de Pompadour so attractive - she was an adult. And not only that, but she'd worked her way up to the pinnacle of court society, so she was not the least naive. And not only that, but she was quite happy to cast him as the wise and brave hero and herself as the sidekick, which he loves to distraction.
Which reminded me of this bit from Anna's post on 'Lineage':
This is where the Wes/Lilah dynamic was extraordinary. Wesley has this overwhelming need to protect, to be the man. Fred won’t stand for it. Little Fred, who’ll go giggly and girly over her lab assistant, doesn’t want him to protect her. But Lilah, strong, powerful Lilah, who watched her own back and only hers, Lilah let him. It’s exactly because she was strong, because she had faith in herself, that she could let him. And so when the Beast comes to ravage W&H she’ll let him play knight to her damsel in distress, because she understands. Understands him, understands her, knows what he needs from her and what she needs from him.
Not that Doctor/Rose is very much like Wes/Fred at all really, I'm just rambling now...
Um, I had another point. I've seen the point made over and over again, that much as people like Ten, they loved Nine and his tortured, guilt-ridden persona more than Ten's happy-go-lucky attitude. And I don't see it like that at all. Just because his feelings are buried deeper down, doesn't make them any less - it possibly makes them more. If Nine was Angel, with the overwhelming need to save and continually haunted by his past, then Ten is more like Spike - presenting the world with bravura and a flip remark, only now and again letting the mask slip (and Spike would absolutely press the giant big button that should never ever be pressed!). (*Very* lose comparisons, please don't begin to point out the flaws!)
Anyway, I must run, but I really, really enjoyed myself! Oh - last point: Of course he had to go save the Madame, even if it was stupid and foolish and hurt Rose terribly - it's like Buffy risking her life every night and nearly getting killed my Random Vamp #1 by accident - if you're a hero, that's what you do!
ETA: Pardon any typos etc, I was in a rush.
And oh what fun it was! :) I absolutely loved it - although my most prominent thought (once I started to think it through afterwards) was 'The Doctor got laid! Yay! (Not a single quack from me - not at all! If this sounds bizarre see this post! Hee.) I utterly adored Madame Pompadour and found the story fascinating... it's funny that I'm such a moral person in RL, but such a complete whore when it comes to TV shows. *g*
Now let me try to get my thoughts into something coherent. Yes I (obviously) ship Rose and the Doctor, but it's one of those impossible ships, as was pointed out very well in the previous episode. He has had other companions before her, and will probably have others after. The fact that he had another one alongside, is not likely to diminish or tarnish his feelings in any way (even though Rose is special!). As he said - he thought the queen and the mistress got on very well! (And he gets along with Mickey, so...) Anyway, although the Doctor/Rose relationship has a lot of UST, then (so far at least) that's all it is. And The Doctor is very much taking the slow road with Rose, partly because she is so very young.
Now Madame de Pompadour is different - I loved the fact that her entire life flashed by in what was only a day for The Doctor, since that is how it must feel for him all the time. As
the_royal_anna put it (in this post):This is the Doctor: caught between two worlds. Moved to love in time but compelled to live out of time.
He knows that one day he'll have to watch Rose's funeral, just like everyone else - so I cannot blame him for grasping any opportunity when it comes along. Like so many men pouring out their hearts to barmaids, sometimes 'a stranger' is what's needed. I've tried and tried to think of anything within the Jossverse that has the same kind of situation, but the nearest is possibly the B/A kiss in Chosen - the pure escapist bliss that was never suppossed to be known to anyone. Or... it's a bit of a stretch, but Wes/Lilah, where his heart belongs to Fred, but still there is definitely a connection with Lilah. Or to borrow words from
harmonyfb:No wonder the Doctor found Madame de Pompadour so attractive - she was an adult. And not only that, but she'd worked her way up to the pinnacle of court society, so she was not the least naive. And not only that, but she was quite happy to cast him as the wise and brave hero and herself as the sidekick, which he loves to distraction.
Which reminded me of this bit from Anna's post on 'Lineage':
This is where the Wes/Lilah dynamic was extraordinary. Wesley has this overwhelming need to protect, to be the man. Fred won’t stand for it. Little Fred, who’ll go giggly and girly over her lab assistant, doesn’t want him to protect her. But Lilah, strong, powerful Lilah, who watched her own back and only hers, Lilah let him. It’s exactly because she was strong, because she had faith in herself, that she could let him. And so when the Beast comes to ravage W&H she’ll let him play knight to her damsel in distress, because she understands. Understands him, understands her, knows what he needs from her and what she needs from him.
Not that Doctor/Rose is very much like Wes/Fred at all really, I'm just rambling now...
Um, I had another point. I've seen the point made over and over again, that much as people like Ten, they loved Nine and his tortured, guilt-ridden persona more than Ten's happy-go-lucky attitude. And I don't see it like that at all. Just because his feelings are buried deeper down, doesn't make them any less - it possibly makes them more. If Nine was Angel, with the overwhelming need to save and continually haunted by his past, then Ten is more like Spike - presenting the world with bravura and a flip remark, only now and again letting the mask slip (and Spike would absolutely press the giant big button that should never ever be pressed!). (*Very* lose comparisons, please don't begin to point out the flaws!)
Anyway, I must run, but I really, really enjoyed myself! Oh - last point: Of course he had to go save the Madame, even if it was stupid and foolish and hurt Rose terribly - it's like Buffy risking her life every night and nearly getting killed my Random Vamp #1 by accident - if you're a hero, that's what you do!
ETA: Pardon any typos etc, I was in a rush.
no subject
Anyway, thank you for this - it was a lovely read. Oh, and you're absolutely right about this too:
Of course he had to go save the Madame, even if it was stupid and foolish and hurt Rose terribly - it's like Buffy risking her life every night and nearly getting killed my Random Vamp #1 by accident - if you're a hero, that's what you do!
I think the dynamic between Rose and the Doctor had to change after the Parting of the Ways - he sent her away to protect her and she wouldn't accept that. He's seen that Rose is a ready to be a hero as he is - that she his is equal in more ways than he had imagined prior to the events of The Parting of the Ways. When he left her behind in the spaceship, he did it knowing that if anyone was strong and brave enough to deal with that, she was.
no subject
My pleasure! :) And you really must come visit some time so I can spoil you in person. ::nods::
So glad you agree with my points, since I'd never be able to argue my way out if you disagreed. (If that made sense?)
Anyway, you're absolutely right about the Rose/Doctor dynamic changing, but I'm afraid I don't have any clever thoughts. Also I need to go read the children a bedtime story.
(Oh and did you follow my first link?
no subject
Oh! I have two whole weeks' leave this summer, so maybe I will be able to come and see you at some point then! Not for the whole two weeks, I should quickly reassure you. :) But it would be lovely to come and say hello for a day, or a bit of a day, or whatever would suit you!
no subject
Hee! I'm surprised at my own lack of duckiness, to be honest - there was a bit early on, but it got swallowed in the sheer fun of the episode! I guess I care more about the Doctor than about Rose... strange. Having thought about it more, I guess it's a little like Ross' one night stand when he and Rachel 'were on a break' (presuming you watched Friends way back when...) or maybe a very, very little like Spike/Anya in Entropy. Dunno, but I just don't mind. It's very peculiar!
so maybe I will be able to come and see you at some point then!
Squeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee! ::does the dance of joy::
That would be brilliant! And one day isn't enough (as I found out when
no subject
Well, since you mention it, there is something I've been meaning to tell you...
;)
Your icon is terribly watchable. I can't drag myself away. :)
no subject
Bwahahahaha! Although as I told him ages ago, it wouldn't really matter since it's your clever brain I fell for first!
And here's another one, they're both by