Interesting how his views on the Time War have morphed over time.
Nine: I *made* it happen.
Ten: I had to stop them.
Amy: You want to be forgiven.
Eleven: I walked away from the Last Great Time War.
Also, an interesting choice to use the phrase "walked away", after all of that emphasis on "we don't walk away". I suppose ending the Time War meets the conditions for holding on to something precious (time itself) and running with it, but it's interesting that Eleven would choose to describe it as "I walked away". Though of course, that whole scene is him being his own worst critic, shouting at a sun-sized mirror. He passes some harsh judgments on himself, but sometimes you've just got to let it all out in order to work through it.
I'm definitely interested to find out what sort of man Eleven will become under Clara's influence. (I'm also super curious about the numbers game Moffat is playing with Clara's life, but that's probably a topic for a different time.)
Love your thoughts, as usual. Your posts always help me figure out what I'm thinking, somehow.
I saw 'walked away' quite differently, and your interpretation hadn't even occurred to me until you posted it. He says: "I walked away from the last great Time War. I marked the passing of the Time Lords".
I definitely read that as: 'I was the only one to walk away from the War alive' - that is, 'No one else survived'.
More later when I'm not running out the door...
ETA: He might have chosen that wording specifically though, as he wasn't setting himself up as a warrior. He wasn't using his name or his acts of destruction as a 'weapon', but focussed on his 'human' qualities.
I'd say there are probably a hundred different ways to interpret it. Clara's reaction really sells it to me though. I can see her taking something away from that.
What exactly she's thinking is open to interpretation, but I think she's realizing that the Doctor doesn't just have values for the sake of values, but that he's learned them from a long lifetime of experiences. In walking away, he learns what can be lost by walking away. And yet, he has also learned the value of protecting those things that are precious, the value of running.
That's just the way I choose to see it though. One interpretation of a couple of facial expressions. I'm rather enjoying watching JLC's face; she's always having reactions to things. She sells a whole thought process in just a couple of looks. It's good fun.
I love that the text can be interpreted so many different ways. This is Moffat at his best. Not so much a mirror as a disco ball. There's something different from every angle and it sheds light in a scattered pattern, giving the scene a slightly different lighting every time you look at it. It becomes very compelling indeed.
I'd say there are probably a hundred different ways to interpret it. Clara's reaction really sells it to me though. I can see her taking something away from that. Ah, I hadn't thought of it in light of that. Thank you.
What exactly she's thinking is open to interpretation, but I think she's realizing that the Doctor doesn't just have values for the sake of values, but that he's learned them from a long lifetime of experiences. *nods* I love the journey of new companions, what they come to understand. (Showing not telling. <3)
That's just the way I choose to see it though. One interpretation of a couple of facial expressions. I'm rather enjoying watching JLC's face; she's always having reactions to things. She sells a whole thought process in just a couple of looks. It's good fun. Mmmm, yes. She has a VERY good face.
I love that the text can be interpreted so many different ways. This is Moffat at his best. Not so much a mirror as a disco ball. Ahahahahahah! That's the PERFECT analogy. *adopts*
There's something different from every angle and it sheds light in a scattered pattern, giving the scene a slightly different lighting every time you look at it. It becomes very compelling indeed. This. The whole thing just sort of blew me away initially, but there was so much there that I couldn't quite take it in. I keep going back and finding more, and yet more. <3
Also, I think I might have to make a banner featuring (parts of) this quote by Moffat (from a few years ago, before Ten regenerated, as Ten's death definitely echoes this in some ways):
Davison's Doctor is beautifully unaware that he is a hero — he simply responds as he feels he must when confronted with evil and injustice, and does so with a very 'human' sense of fluster and outrage. In one of the comparatively few perfect decisions in Doctor Who, Davison is allowed to finally expire saving, not the entire universe, but just one life. This isn't to show, as has been suggested, that he's any less capable or powerful than the other Doctors —just that, for him, saving one life is as great an imperative as saving a galaxy. This, then, is the Doctor as I believe he ought to be — someone who would brave a supernova to rescue a kitten from a tree.
This episode was essentially the Doctor doing just that. Except the supernova was a god, and the kitten was a little girl. :)
Ah, yes. The Caves of Androzani. Good one. Well-contrasted against the death he *expects* in EoT. He's expecting to go out saving the whole of creation from some fresh hell. And then he survives it all, but still gives his life for Wilf the kitten.
And echoed again in Akhaten. There wouldn't have been any trouble at all if he had just left the little girl to sacrifice herself, if he had walked away. And yet he involves himself, and is fully prepared to sacrifice himself in her stead.
...for him, saving one life is as great an imperative as saving a galaxy.
Got it in one with that. I can almost see in my head, those words across images of Five carrying Perry, Ten telling Wilf it's his honor, and Eleven telling Merry that she's unique in the universe.
Well-contrasted against the death he *expects* in EoT. He's expecting to go out saving the whole of creation from some fresh hell. And then he survives it all, but still gives his life for Wilf the kitten. RTD always had that death in mind - not Wilf specifically, but a very low-key death. Initially it would have been a 'nobody' - just a random person the Doctor didn't even know. But then Wilf was a possibility and well... the rest is history. (Seriously, The Writers Tale is worth buying, just for that moment when RTD figures out the whole Wilf thing. *flails*)
And echoed again in Akhaten. There wouldn't have been any trouble at all if he had just left the little girl to sacrifice herself, if he had walked away. And yet he involves himself, and is fully prepared to sacrifice himself in her stead. Someone - calapine?) - suggested that when he'd been there before, with Susan, he'd become aware of the way they would occasionally sacrifice humans, but was at that stage still very much in the non-intervention mindset, and is now looking to put it right.
Got it in one with that. Brilliant, isn't it?
I can almost see in my head, those words across images of Five carrying Perry, Ten telling Wilf it's his honor, and Eleven telling Merry that she's unique in the universe. I love that speech to Merry. It's long, and quite complicated, and there really isn't time, but this is what's important to him. He believes (and is ready to die) for every word.
I'll have to consider it some time when I've got more cash to spare.
Someone - calapine?) - suggested that when he'd been there before, with Susan, he'd become aware of the way they would occasionally sacrifice humans, but was at that stage still very much in the non-intervention mindset, and is now looking to put it right.
I can see that from One. With him it was usually the companions intervening. He grew up though.
I'll have to consider it some time when I've got more cash to spare. It is the best book I've ever read on writing. He captures what it's about and how it works and what it feels like nothing else.
I can see that from One. With him it was usually the companions intervening. He grew up though. He sure did.
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Nine: I *made* it happen.
Ten: I had to stop them.
Amy: You want to be forgiven.
Eleven: I walked away from the Last Great Time War.
Also, an interesting choice to use the phrase "walked away", after all of that emphasis on "we don't walk away". I suppose ending the Time War meets the conditions for holding on to something precious (time itself) and running with it, but it's interesting that Eleven would choose to describe it as "I walked away". Though of course, that whole scene is him being his own worst critic, shouting at a sun-sized mirror. He passes some harsh judgments on himself, but sometimes you've just got to let it all out in order to work through it.
I'm definitely interested to find out what sort of man Eleven will become under Clara's influence. (I'm also super curious about the numbers game Moffat is playing with Clara's life, but that's probably a topic for a different time.)
Love your thoughts, as usual. Your posts always help me figure out what I'm thinking, somehow.
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*LOVES THEM BOTH*
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I saw 'walked away' quite differently, and your interpretation hadn't even occurred to me until you posted it. He says: "I walked away from the last great Time War. I marked the passing of the Time Lords".
I definitely read that as: 'I was the only one to walk away from the War alive' - that is, 'No one else survived'.
More later when I'm not running out the door...
ETA: He might have chosen that wording specifically though, as he wasn't setting himself up as a warrior. He wasn't using his name or his acts of destruction as a 'weapon', but focussed on his 'human' qualities.
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What exactly she's thinking is open to interpretation, but I think she's realizing that the Doctor doesn't just have values for the sake of values, but that he's learned them from a long lifetime of experiences. In walking away, he learns what can be lost by walking away. And yet, he has also learned the value of protecting those things that are precious, the value of running.
That's just the way I choose to see it though. One interpretation of a couple of facial expressions. I'm rather enjoying watching JLC's face; she's always having reactions to things. She sells a whole thought process in just a couple of looks. It's good fun.
I love that the text can be interpreted so many different ways. This is Moffat at his best. Not so much a mirror as a disco ball. There's something different from every angle and it sheds light in a scattered pattern, giving the scene a slightly different lighting every time you look at it. It becomes very compelling indeed.
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Ah, I hadn't thought of it in light of that. Thank you.
What exactly she's thinking is open to interpretation, but I think she's realizing that the Doctor doesn't just have values for the sake of values, but that he's learned them from a long lifetime of experiences.
*nods* I love the journey of new companions, what they come to understand. (Showing not telling. <3)
That's just the way I choose to see it though. One interpretation of a couple of facial expressions. I'm rather enjoying watching JLC's face; she's always having reactions to things. She sells a whole thought process in just a couple of looks. It's good fun.
Mmmm, yes. She has a VERY good face.
I love that the text can be interpreted so many different ways. This is Moffat at his best. Not so much a mirror as a disco ball.
Ahahahahahah! That's the PERFECT analogy. *adopts*
There's something different from every angle and it sheds light in a scattered pattern, giving the scene a slightly different lighting every time you look at it. It becomes very compelling indeed.
This. The whole thing just sort of blew me away initially, but there was so much there that I couldn't quite take it in. I keep going back and finding more, and yet more. <3
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I must have watched from the song to the end about a dozen times now. It's the scene that keeps on giving. *nods*
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Also, I think I might have to make a banner featuring (parts of) this quote by Moffat (from a few years ago, before Ten regenerated, as Ten's death definitely echoes this in some ways):
Davison's Doctor is beautifully unaware that he is a hero — he simply responds as he feels he must when confronted with evil and injustice, and does so with a very 'human' sense of fluster and outrage. In one of the comparatively few perfect decisions in Doctor Who, Davison is allowed to finally expire saving, not the entire universe, but just one life. This isn't to show, as has been suggested, that he's any less capable or powerful than the other Doctors —just that, for him, saving one life is as great an imperative as saving a galaxy. This, then, is the Doctor as I believe he ought to be — someone who would brave a supernova to rescue a kitten from a tree.
This episode was essentially the Doctor doing just that. Except the supernova was a god, and the kitten was a little girl. :)
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And echoed again in Akhaten. There wouldn't have been any trouble at all if he had just left the little girl to sacrifice herself, if he had walked away. And yet he involves himself, and is fully prepared to sacrifice himself in her stead.
...for him, saving one life is as great an imperative as saving a galaxy.
Got it in one with that. I can almost see in my head, those words across images of Five carrying Perry, Ten telling Wilf it's his honor, and Eleven telling Merry that she's unique in the universe.
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RTD always had that death in mind - not Wilf specifically, but a very low-key death. Initially it would have been a 'nobody' - just a random person the Doctor didn't even know. But then Wilf was a possibility and well... the rest is history. (Seriously, The Writers Tale is worth buying, just for that moment when RTD figures out the whole Wilf thing. *flails*)
And echoed again in Akhaten. There wouldn't have been any trouble at all if he had just left the little girl to sacrifice herself, if he had walked away. And yet he involves himself, and is fully prepared to sacrifice himself in her stead.
Someone -
Got it in one with that.
Brilliant, isn't it?
I can almost see in my head, those words across images of Five carrying Perry, Ten telling Wilf it's his honor, and Eleven telling Merry that she's unique in the universe.
I love that speech to Merry. It's long, and quite complicated, and there really isn't time, but this is what's important to him. He believes (and is ready to die) for every word.
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I'll have to consider it some time when I've got more cash to spare.
Someone - calapine?) - suggested that when he'd been there before, with Susan, he'd become aware of the way they would occasionally sacrifice humans, but was at that stage still very much in the non-intervention mindset, and is now looking to put it right.
I can see that from One. With him it was usually the companions intervening. He grew up though.
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It is the best book I've ever read on writing. He captures what it's about and how it works and what it feels like nothing else.
I can see that from One. With him it was usually the companions intervening. He grew up though.
He sure did.